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Joined: Apr 2006
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Dear all

Please download the PDF file below to find out more about this new project for Piano World Forum users only!

http://www.devilishpublishing.com/files/worldofpiano.pdf


James McFadyen
Black & White Editions (c/o Devilish Publishing)
NEW PIANO MUSIC DEALS - http://www.blackandwhiteeditions.com/
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Anyone know anything about these guys?

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We've been in publishing since 2002 but recently opened Black & White Editions to trade our piano catalogue.


James McFadyen
Black & White Editions (c/o Devilish Publishing)
NEW PIANO MUSIC DEALS - http://www.blackandwhiteeditions.com/
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James,
The info page says that "The copyright will be owned by
Devilish Publishing Music Publishers..."

Can you elaborate on that? What part of the publishing will the composer retain?

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Just to clarify that Devilish Publishing would retain 100% of the copyrights. We would promote you as a composer, aim to have your music performed and recorded and licence to other 3rd parties.


James McFadyen
Black & White Editions (c/o Devilish Publishing)
NEW PIANO MUSIC DEALS - http://www.blackandwhiteeditions.com/
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Hi James,

You're rather blithe about composers assigning copyrights to your company 100%. What you don't mention is whether they (we) retain an interest through your company in performance royalties, licenses, internet sales of recordings, sales of CDs, and any other benefit a composer might enjoy by retaining an interest in their copyright. Assigning copyright to your company could be a good thing if facilitates collection of those monies and disbursement of some proportion to the content creator. If on the other hand the only interest the composer retains is 2% of gross receipts of print music sales then I'll suggest you go pound sand.


Steve Chandler
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stevechandler-music.com
http://www.soundcloud.com/pantonality
http://www.youtube.com/pantonality
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I'm not sure it's worth selling a copyright for a song.

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The point of a publishing company is they have greater resources to approach the market than any individual composer can muster. Add to that the fact that most content creators would rather create content than market themselves and it's apparent that the music publisher - content creator relationship can indeed be mutually beneficial. If James' company shares revenue from all streams with the composer then it could be a very advantageous deal. If all they're offering is 2% of gross print music receipts and they keep everything else then in my opinion their company is appropriately named.

Music publishers can indeed be predatory. I saw a video of Aaron Copland telling the story of his first published work. After a concert in Paris the publisher Durand came up to him and asked if the piece that was performed in the concert was published. When Copland responded no Durand invited him to come by his office the next day with the piece and he would publish the work. When Copland came by Durand handed him a check and a piece of paper and said sign here and we'll publish your work. Only later did he realize that he had signed away all rights to the work. My point is that music publishers can help composers or they can rob them. Copland didn't ask questions and didn't negotiate a deal and got robbed (though the lesson was well learned as Copland was a more astute businessman from then on). Getting robbed doesn't have to happen if you ask questions and are willing to negotiate.

The pdf that James links to makes no mention of any additional compensation to composers other than 2% of gross print music receipts. They do mention that they'll promote their composers (for mutual benefit), that they'll shop your music around for licensing and pursue performances and recordings (presumably to their benefit). Such efforts should benefit all parties, after all if content creators don't create content they'll have nothing to promote. I'd like to give James the opportunity to revise his offer to one that allows composers some compensation for a share of all revenue streams.

Last edited by Steve Chandler; 04/10/09 02:21 PM.

Steve Chandler
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stevechandler-music.com
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I take great offence to what has been said here regarding copyright and as such will make a decision and to wether or not we shall invest the time and money on this project.

The PDF is an initial guide only and I when I have choosen the right music, I shall start to formulate proceedings OUTWITH the public domain.

If composers are happy to earn 100% of nothing rather than 2% of something and have their music in the shops then I shall accept that. I will make a formal decision tomorrow. But in the meantime please think about the time and money I am spending on this project.

Last edited by Devilish Publishing; 04/10/09 06:29 PM.

James McFadyen
Black & White Editions (c/o Devilish Publishing)
NEW PIANO MUSIC DEALS - http://www.blackandwhiteeditions.com/
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sudoplatov, here's my thought:

Never give up your copyright.

In today's world it's never worth it.

James, I applaud your effort and even the idea, but if you insist on having copyright (that belongs to the one(s) who create the music in my view) then it is no service at all.

I can compose, create, score, create demos and even distribute on the internet and likely gain more benefit and profit than what I believe I'd get from you and this scheme.

If you are willing to re-consider and amend the "deal" to something more win-win as suggested by Steve then you might get some takers.


P.S. the tone of your response above pretty much seals the deal for me and I will certainly keep you and your company in mind.



Last edited by kennychaffin; 04/10/09 06:51 PM.

Kenny A. Chaffin
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Steve has jumped the gun by a long shot. There is no end of people thinking they know what the score is. Trust me when I say that it is a win-win deal. The 2% royalty is sheet music sales alone. The compsoer is entitled to 100% of the writers share from recordings and performances. It's not always as clean cut as that as the "writers share" will probably be divided up between different writers if on a full CD. So it may be 10% of 100% of the writers share.

It can get a lot more complicated than that. The MCPS for example will normally pay the composers directly their (part) of the 100% writers share.

HOWEVER!!.... and I do wish to stress this point quite clearly, our primary aim is put your music in a professional published book and get it into the shops. DO NOT EXPECT MIRACLES OVERNIGHT. All you need to do is put in a day's effort and I'll put in years of effort. Recordings and performances will come but at first it will not be priority.

Extra (small) contracts can be drawn up to waive certain rights or licence new ones.

Hope this makes things clear. We are very much behind you as composers and your music.

All in all what I'm trying to say is that although us retaining 100% of the copyright might at first seem unfair, it actually works in your favour by giving us as much opportunity to licence the work and create revenue streams in the future, but MORE IMPORTANTLY, allow us to control where that music goes and is not freely distributed therfore bypassing us, putting us out of business and bang goes another small indie publishing house to promote your music.

Oh, let the project be fun!! smile Sucesfull applicants will gain more info on royalties and other %'s and will then have the option to seal the deal or not.

Happy writing! smile


James McFadyen
Black & White Editions (c/o Devilish Publishing)
NEW PIANO MUSIC DEALS - http://www.blackandwhiteeditions.com/
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Not being a composer, I can't tell you if this is good, bad, or indifferent.

However, never sign any contracts, or sign away your rights to your own hard work, without checking with legal counsel.

Also please note, nobody from Devilish Publishing has approached me for permission or feedback about this idea, which means I have not condoned it.

Unlike our PW CD Project which we are quite proud of.





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OK.

I can confirm that we are withdrawing this project with immediate effect. Thanks for the entries so far, we appreciate your effort but we shant be taking this project forward.

Kind Regards



James McFadyen
Black & White Editions (c/o Devilish Publishing)
NEW PIANO MUSIC DEALS - http://www.blackandwhiteeditions.com/
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Originally Posted by Devilish Publishing
OK.

I can confirm that we are withdrawing this project with immediate effect. Thanks for the entries so far, we appreciate your effort but we shant be taking this project forward.

Kind Regards



Translation, "you people weren't silly enough to accept our terms".



- Frank B.
Original Founder of Piano World
Owner of...
www.PianoSupplies.com
Maine Piano Man

My Keyboards:
Estonia L-190, Roland RD88, Yamaha P-80, Bilhorn Telescope Organ c 1880, Antique Pump Organ, 1850 concertina, 3 other digital pianos
-------------------------
My original piece on BandCamp: https://frankbaxtermrpianoworld.bandcamp.com/releases

Me banging out some tunes in the Estonia piano booth at the NAMM show...


It's Fun To Play the Piano ... PLEASE Pass It On!




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