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Assuming an advanced amateur pianist who can play the Chopin Etudes Opus 10 no 1,2,4,8,12 well what would be a competitive program for each stage of the 2015 Van Cliburn Amateur Piano Competition?
Serge P. Marinkovic, MD
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Serge,
I think it depends entirely on the player. You should play things you 1- want to play, 2- that you do well, and 3- show off as much versatility as possible.
What kind of program(s) were you thinking of?
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Worry first about your first round. And no offense intended, that's the only round most people have to worry about playing.  Probably most people who apply don't get accepted, and most who do get accepted only play one round, which already is quite an honor. Assuming the format will be similar to before, the first round will be 10-12 minutes, and the most important thing in such a demanding amateur competition is to put your best foot forward, I mean right away. So first of all, figure out what your first round might be -- and not just because that's the most important thing but also because it'll help us answer you further. When we see your first round, we can do a more meaningful job of guiding you further. In fact, I think right now we have essentially no basis at all for guiding you further, even with what you've told us. BTW, great that you're thinking of entering!! I hope to apply and to be accepted, and I hope to see you there.
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I was thinking about the etudes I listed for round one. Second round Schubert Wanderer, third round-Beethoven Opus 57.
Thank you for your encouragement. Its a lot of practice to be competitive but a dream to play on that stage with everyone else and if I am lucky enough to make it the first time around.
Last edited by Serge Marinkovic; 11/16/13 02:23 AM.
Serge P. Marinkovic, MD
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I was thinking about the etudes I listed for round one.... That would probably be suicidal. Even if you could basically nail them (which most people couldn't, in the setting of being in a major amateur competition for the first time), you wouldn't be viewed favorably for playing such repertoire as a whole round unless you were near-world-class (which not too many of us amateurs are) -- you would be viewed as trying to prove something that you're not proving -- and you probably wouldn't advance unless you not only nailed them but did something pretty special with them. Cliff's Notes: Don't.  Maybe have 1 or 2 of the Etudes in the round, but include something else.
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You should do whatever you do best, and that can make an impression. It has to show yourself off technically, and it has to show an obvious musical personality (that the judges will accept). Most players come off so "beige" and inoffensive that nobody could like their playing. You'll have to find a middle ground while still saying something.
If these études do that for you, then that's great.
Your first round must also be the most solid and reliable of everything you'll play. If you haven't started performing these pieces, start now. You must trot them out before the public as often as you can before the competition. I would not present them myself, or let any of my students present them until I/we'd performed them at least a dozen times before live audiences.
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I will start with a few retirement communities in my locale and see how my playing responds.
Serge P. Marinkovic, MD
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One quick addition to the discussion: if you find yourself short on audiences, you can substitute the audience for something else that gets your "anxiety muscle" worked up. For me, it's recording. I get just as worked up (if not more) when recording as when performing live. So, I usually record myself until I'm comfortable performing in one shot, then go play live.
Every day we are afforded a new chance. The problem with life is not that you run out of chances. In the end, what you run out of are days.
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I really am use to talking in front of people and now as I get older I notice it apples to my playing the piano too. I use to get so diaphoretic to talk to a group of people that I would have to change my dress shirt. But twenty years later I can talk to a few thousand physicians without a script for an hour successfully. My piano is now approaching the same, it's becoming natural to play without fear or apprehension but with a will to have some fun. I just hope my playing is entertaining.
Serge P. Marinkovic, MD
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So run it by us once again, Serge.
What exactly is your program(s)?
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Most players come off so "beige" and inoffensive that nobody could like their playing. Right. You know it's a good artist when everyone either loves them or hates them -- to be extreme.
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Most players come off so "beige" and inoffensive that nobody could like their playing. Right. You know it's a good artist when everyone either loves them or hates them -- to be extreme. +1 Try to please everyone, and you will please no one.
Regards,
Polyphonist
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Most players come off so "beige" and inoffensive that nobody could like their playing. Right. You know it's a good artist when everyone either loves them or hates them -- to be extreme. There are a lot of great artists who don't fall into that category. Of course, this is the thinking Bang Bang fans cling to justify their ignorance (not talking about you Joel).
"And if we look at the works of J.S. Bach — a benevolent god to which all musicians should offer a prayer to defend themselves against mediocrity... -Debussy
"It's ok if you disagree with me. I can't force you to be right."
♪ ≠$
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If I am lucky to make it to the competition at all.
Round 1
Chopin Opus 10 no 1, 2,4, Opus 25 no 6,8, 12.
Round 2
Schubert Wanderer
Round 3
Beethoven Opus 57
Potentially flip flop Round 2 and 3.
I will not need music for Round 1 but will need the music for 2 and 3.
Again I do not want to assume anything this is very optimal thinking with a lot of prayer and luck to just get an invitation.
Serge P. Marinkovic, MD
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Serge,
Learn the music. Don't use the scores. There's enough time to do this. Not only does it make you look unprepared, having the score on your music desk will get in your way. Having a page turner there will not make you feel any less alone.
Everybody else will have their music memorized.
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....Everybody else will have their music memorized. Actually not. A fair number of the contestants use the score, including sometimes contestants who advance pretty far. Also: While I agree with you completely about the general principle of the advantages of playing without the score and I can't imagine that I'd ever do otherwise, I also think it's not worth it for someone to force it. 'Other things being equal' it's better in many ways to play without the score. But if other things aren't equal, which for many people they aren't, the balance is easily very tipped.
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You know your both right. I think with enough practice runs through retirement homes I think I can get it memorized well. Mark C what are you think of playing for 2015 Van Cliburn?
Serge P. Marinkovic, MD
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Thanks for asking -- but I have almost no idea. I thought I had it tentatively worked out already last year, but then 'stuff happened' that brought everything to a halt and then led to a different mind set. Whatever I play comes from mind set  ....and that's still shaking out, so I really don't know yet what I'll be playing in a year or two. I was planning on Chopin and Scriabin, but lately I've found myself playing mostly Brahms, Schubert, Mozart, and Bach, so I couldn't tell you.
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Most players come off so "beige" and inoffensive that nobody could like their playing. Right. You know it's a good artist when everyone either loves them or hates them -- to be extreme. There are a lot of great artists who don't fall into that category. Of course, this is the thinking Bang Bang fans cling to justify their ignorance (not talking about you Joel). I know there are, but in my opinion, most great artists stand out from the crowd. I know from past conversations with you that you support originality. The way I see it, when someone has such a distinct personality, they're usually pretty extreme, and most people, if well-exposed to them, will take a strong opinion with or against them. It's only natural. Obviously there are those who will be indifferent, but that's not my point. My point is that those who stand out will have a far greater number of people who either hate them or love them. Take Pogorelich for example. Many people will like some stuff here and dislike some stuff there, but there will be a large group of people that LOVE everything he does, and a large group of people that HATE everything he does. I cannot say the same about less eccentric artists like Zimerman for example. With people like Zimerman, you have the die-hard fans and you have the unopinionated folk. I've never come across anyone professing their strong disapproval for Zimerman. There's just nothing to be so strongly against, the way there is for eccentric artists.
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Most players come off so "beige" and inoffensive that nobody could like their playing. Right. You know it's a good artist when everyone either loves them or hates them -- to be extreme. There are a lot of great artists who don't fall into that category. Of course, this is the thinking Bang Bang fans cling to justify their ignorance (not talking about you Joel). I know there are, but in my opinion, most great artists stand out from the crowd. I know from past conversations with you that you support originality. The way I see it, when someone has such a distinct personality, they're usually pretty extreme, and most people, if well-exposed to them, will take a strong opinion with or against them. It's only natural. Obviously there are those who will be indifferent, but that's not my point. My point is that those who stand out will have a far greater number of people who either hate them or love them. Take Pogorelich for example. Many people will like some stuff here and dislike some stuff there, but there will be a large group of people that LOVE everything he does, and a large group of people that HATE everything he does. I cannot say the same about less eccentric artists like Zimerman for example. With people like Zimerman, you have the die-hard fans and you have the unopinionated folk. I've never come across anyone professing their strong disapproval for Zimerman. There's just nothing to be so strongly against, the way there is for eccentric artists. +1
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