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Estonia Pianos
Estonia Pianos
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Joined: May 2001
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Originally Posted by Piano90X
Originally Posted by phacke
There were a few people seeming like they were pulling their hair out (figuratively) with problems with their Estonia.
It sounds like there were some consistent issues with Estonias. What were the problems? Have they since been addressed by the company?
I don't remember how many Estonia buyers had complaints but it was either one or two. That is an insignificant number. Hardly "consistent issues".

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Originally Posted by Rickster

You can get a lemon in any brand. What sets a company/manufacturer apart from the others is how they handle that "lemon" on behalf of the buyer/customer. And, it also has a lot to do with the dealer.

Some pianos manufacturers/dealers will leave you hanging and stuck with a lemon; some will do the right thing, no matter how far they have to go (replace the piano with a new one/issue a full refund?).

My advice to a piano shopper would be to research the personality/reputation of the manufacturer and dealer as much as the piano itself.

And, I doubt if there are really any "perfect" pianos out there or "perfect" dealers.
Good points.

Last edited by pianoloverus; 09/10/16 10:31 AM.
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IMHO, there has always seemed to be a good deal of this kind-of bias, esp. as it relates to S&S. Of course, for many of us, Steinway will always be the piano of choice, at least for concert purposes.
Some years back, when the Astoria product was suffering, significantly, and the great European houses (Bosendorfer, Bechstein, etc.) were producing instruments with a VERY distinctive tone & touch, differences were very obvious, and it was possible to plant one's foot in just one camp, for very specific reasons.
Nowadays, when most of the major piano makers are building instruments, especially concert grands, very, very little different from the S&S D, it sometimes takes a good deal of imagination and "confirmation bias" to hold-out for one make only.
In writing the above, I think it obvious that ALL the top builders are capable of making truly remarkable concert instruments and do so each year. It's the lack, or more truly, the LOSS of a truly distinctive face or personality, that seems to have become the norm in the present MARKETPLACE.

Just my very feeble opinion.

Karl Watson,
Staten Island, NY

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Originally Posted by pianoloverus
Originally Posted by Piano90X
Originally Posted by phacke
There were a few people seeming like they were pulling their hair out (figuratively) with problems with their Estonia.
It sounds like there were some consistent issues with Estonias. What were the problems? Have they since been addressed by the company?
I don't remember how many Estonia buyers had complaints but it was either one or two. That is an insignificant number. Hardly "consistent issues".


I only remember one buyer who complained consistently.


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Two things ...

First, about this:
Originally Posted by Piano90X
I have never seen a comment from someone who spent a significant amount of money on a piano and who later regretted it.
Isn't that just sample bias?
Of all the regretful buyers, how many of them have ever come to PW?
Of those, how many have seen fit to post about the regret?
And, in general, are regretters as likely to post their regrets as satisfied owners are to express satisfaction?
Who knows?

Secondly, I'm not too happy with my piano. I'll be looking for a new one next week. So there's one regretter for you.

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Originally Posted by MacMacMac
Secondly, I'm not too happy with my piano. I'll be looking for a new one next week. So there's one regretter for you.

Life's too short to be unhappy and dissatisfied with your piano. Go ahead and trade it in for another one or sell yours and get what you want. thumb

Rick



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Originally Posted by MacMacMac


Secondly, I'm not too happy with my piano. I'll be looking for a new one next week. So there's one regretter for you.


What kind of piano do you have? What do you dislike about it? What kind of other pianos are you considering?

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Originally Posted by malkin
Originally Posted by pianoloverus
Originally Posted by Piano90X
Originally Posted by phacke
There were a few people seeming like they were pulling their hair out (figuratively) with problems with their Estonia.
It sounds like there were some consistent issues with Estonias. What were the problems? Have they since been addressed by the company?
I don't remember how many Estonia buyers had complaints but it was either one or two. That is an insignificant number. Hardly "consistent issues".


I only remember one buyer who complained consistently.


That wasn't the case. One person did complain and post a lot about the issues he was having with odd sounds on his Estonia, but it seemed like a lot of it was everyone was getting mad at him for pointing out a potential design issue and him defending himself. I'd have to go back and re-read. That member ultimately sold his Estonia at a loss

What I remember most was a lot of people got mad at him for saying less than stellar things about his Estonia, claiming they had never heard anything like that so it must have been a one off issue, but in reality there turned out to be several other members who also reported similar problems. In one case I think Estonia actually took a piano back. Back all the way to Estonia.
I suspect the company fixed whatever the issue was on later models, maybe by fixing a logitudinal mode or something, but it was amazing how everyone jumped on that member for criticizing his piano. I thought he was doing shoppers a favor.

Edit: I searched and found a couple of threads where people complained about odd sounds or ringing tones from their Estonia 190's, but not the one where the guy sold it and everyone got mad at him.

Last edited by Toddler2; 09/10/16 09:56 PM. Reason: search

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Originally Posted by pianoloverus
Originally Posted by Steve Cohen
My very well-seasoned experience leads me to the conclusion that the overwhelming percentage of reviews and comments are confrontational bias.
Could you explain a little more what you mean by confrontational bias?


Yes. My auto-speller substituted "confrontational" for "confirmational"!!!!

Sorry!!!


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Originally Posted by Steve Cohen


Yes. My auto-speller substituted "confrontational" for "confirmational"!!!!

Sorry!!!


It's okay. Just make sure that you spell things right next time you participate in one of my threads. wink

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Yes, Sir!!


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I still think confrontational bias is a real Internet phenomenon.


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Reminds me of a debate I had with my science-y daughter. I had been taking these supplements, and felt great as a result. She was convinced it was a placebo effect. I countered with "well, if it's a placebo effect, it's the best darn placebo effect I've ever had, and I'll keep doing it!"

For me, it's the same with pianos. When I come across one I love, that's the one. That's true for different brands and wildly different price points. To be clear, I'm not going to pay attention to someone trying to convince me that I shouldn't like what I like. It's like someone trying to convince me I shouldn't have married my wife. Really.

There is no "best", just what makes you happy. Only a few piano purchases over the years haven't worked out, the rest were winners.

Confirmation bias or no confirmation bias, I'm happy.


Life is too short to be playing bad music.

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