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#2901611 10/18/19 12:28 PM
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I was just listening to Reminiscences de Norma, and there is a full on ii-V-I using straight up jazz voicings. It's Emin9 / A7(13) / Dmaj9. That's pretty cool!!! Check out around 7:16-7:24 in the below video. Just wanted to share this as I just noticed it and it's awesome to see this kind of stuff in 19th century music. Usually when there is something "jazzy" it's one chord snuck in, but this is a true ii-V-I.


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Not sure if that harmonic progression comes directly from the opera or not, but yes Liszt was very advanced harmonically. He pretty much started Impressionism.

Listen to this Schumann piece and see if you catch any weird harmonies and progressions:


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Beautiful moment! And nice catch:) Thank you for sharing. It reminded me of the vi-ii-V-I in the slow theme of his B minor sonata. Although the voicing is not as pronounced because of the moving notes and because the 9th in the ii and V resolves upward. (12:28, and then again at 27:03 in B major).

(And for some reason, in my head the third beat of the bar with the dominant (tenor voice) was a G double sharp (augmented 5th) instead of a G, which would make it much more "jazzy":))


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@achoo42 - 4:47-4:55 is awesome! Heard this piece many times but this just stuck out upon a relisten.

@Rania - Definitely, such a beautiful moment. See also 15:40 - 15:52, probably my favorite moment in the piece.

Also, the Spanish Rhapsody starts with a min7 chord i believe.

Like I said though, the Norma progression is sooooo jazzy, each of those chords is an extended one and there's three in a row, very rare for the time!

Last edited by didyougethathing; 10/18/19 05:10 PM.
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I love the incredible diversity of character Liszt's compositions have. E.g.:
The diabolic/satanic:

The angelic/divine:

The lover/romantic:

The "fun", virtuosic, light hearted:

The morbid:

The impressionist, visionary:


Ok... I'll stop now, I think you get the point grin But in my opinion, no other piano composer was a match for Liszt's musical juggernaut.

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Originally Posted by didyougethathing
I was just listening to Reminiscences de Norma, and there is a full on ii-V-I using straight up jazz voicings. It's Emin9 / A7(13) / Dmaj9. That's pretty cool!!! Check out around 7:16-7:24 in the below video. Just wanted to share this as I just noticed it and it's awesome to see this kind of stuff in 19th century music. Usually when there is something "jazzy" it's one chord snuck in, but this is a true ii-V-I.



That's really cool -- it is like a progression straight out of jazz.

John Mehegan's landmark Jazz book series attributes the first appearance of a specific rootless voicing of ii-V-I progression used by modern jazz pianists to Chopin, where the two chord includes a minor ninth, the five chord has 9 and 13, and the one chord has added six and nine. Unfortunately he doesn't back that statement up with any specific examples, other than to say that it "became one of the vernacular sounds of the Nineteenth-Century piano concerto." I would have liked to have seen a nice example like the Liszt example you just pointed out.

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Originally Posted by scriabinfanatic
Originally Posted by didyougethathing
I was just listening to Reminiscences de Norma, and there is a full on ii-V-I using straight up jazz voicings. It's Emin9 / A7(13) / Dmaj9. That's pretty cool!!! Check out around 7:16-7:24 in the below video. Just wanted to share this as I just noticed it and it's awesome to see this kind of stuff in 19th century music. Usually when there is something "jazzy" it's one chord snuck in, but this is a true ii-V-I.



That's really cool -- it is like a progression straight out of jazz.

John Mehegan's landmark Jazz book series attributes the first appearance of a specific rootless voicing of ii-V-I progression used by modern jazz pianists to Chopin, where the two chord includes a minor ninth, the five chord has 9 and 13, and the one chord has added six and nine. Unfortunately he doesn't back that statement up with any specific examples, other than to say that it "became one of the vernacular sounds of the Nineteenth-Century piano concerto." I would have liked to have seen a nice example like the Liszt example you just pointed out.




That's really interesting! Yeah I wish he gave the example, but I guess i'll keep an ear out for something that sounds like that.

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Originally Posted by didyougethathing
@achoo42 - 4:47-4:55 is awesome! Heard this piece many times but this just stuck out upon a relisten.

@Rania - Definitely, such a beautiful moment. See also 15:40 - 15:52, probably my favorite moment in the piece.

Also, the Spanish Rhapsody starts with a min7 chord i believe.

Like I said though, the Norma progression is sooooo jazzy, each of those chords is an extended one and there's three in a row, very rare for the time!




Liszt has a lot of fun with tonality in this piece.

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Originally Posted by AAC127
I love the incredible diversity of character Liszt's compositions have. E.g.:
The diabolic/satanic:

The angelic/divine:

The lover/romantic:

The "fun", virtuosic, light hearted:

The morbid:

The impressionist, visionary:


Ok... I'll stop now, I think you get the point grin But in my opinion, no other piano composer was a match for Liszt's musical juggernaut.



+1. Liszt is my favorite, by far!



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