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Joined: Nov 2009
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Hi everyone,
Although I am the second most prolific PW poster I have never posted on or read the digital forum! I have a 15 year old Mason & Hamlin BB and have not considered buying a non acoustic piano until now. I am hoping that those of you more familiar with these two models(which is almost everyone reading this post) can compare and contrast the touch and tone of these two models for me. For the Avantgrand I would only be considering the ones that come in a vertical type case, i.e. not what I think is called the N3.
My motivation for considering a hybrid is to be able to play silently and listen through headphones or to be able to play very softly. Besides the touch and tone, if you consider other things to be pros or cons please feel free to mention them. But I am not generally interested in(or even probably able to understand) the very technical information or details about the bells and whistles of each model which I assume are important to at least some of you.
Thanks for your help. I note you also raised another thread to discuss acoustic muting rail and silent systems. I did not see much feedback on this, examples being the latest Yamaha Transacoustic systems or Kawai ATX/Aures. If you still have the desire to hear the encompassing string, soundboard and cabinet resonance etc, and your circumstances permit occasional playing without headphones, these may be worth looking into as well.
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Joined: Jun 2013
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If I may, CG, this might also come in handy for what some pianists call ‘halo notes’:
A ‘technique’ where the pianist is able to land -only so much- on certain keys/notes without triggering any sound or simply triggering a soft “halo” sound.
This helps in very dense and jumpy (all over the place) passages where the pianist can use these halo notes as ‘anchors’ or place-holders for the actual notes he or she wants to hear, or, as said above, for a specific yet abstract halo effect.
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Joined: Dec 2019
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Novus NV10
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Joined: Aug 2020
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chiming in here as a newish owner of the NV10: key length has been debated ad nauseum on these forums. i can't imagine any key length shorter than the NV10. when practicing Gaspard and some of the other romantic powerhouses, my hands are bumping up against the fallboard on occasion. it's super annoying 
Last edited by Heddy; 10/28/20 01:39 PM.
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Joined: Apr 2007
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chiming in here as a newish owner of the NV10: key length has been debated ad nauseum on these forums. i can't imagine any key length shorter than the NV10. when practicing Gaspard and some of the other romantic powerhouses, my hands are brushing against the fallboard on occasion. it's super annoying It’s not about the visible part of the keys You will brush your fingers on every piano, acoustic or digital because they will have the same visible length. It’s about the key length *behind* the fallboard to the fulcrum. The longer it is, the less difference it will make where you press the key across its visible length.
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chiming in here as a newish owner of the NV10: key length has been debated ad nauseum on these forums. i can't imagine any key length shorter than the NV10. when practicing Gaspard and some of the other romantic powerhouses, my hands are brushing against the fallboard on occasion. it's super annoying It’s not about the visible part of the keys You will brush your fingers on every piano, acoustic or digital because they will have the same visible length. It’s about the key length *behind* the fallboard to the fulcrum. The longer it is, the less difference it will make where you press the key across its visible length. I think he/she might be kidding around. Unless he/she really thought key length had to do with the visible part of the keys. Kind of hard to believe (especially if someone has been following the "ad nauseam" threads on the subject), but possible. God bless, David
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Joined: Apr 2007
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Well, yes, I also thought it was a fun comment but I re-read it a few times and it seems like it may be serious.
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Joined: Aug 2020
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Well, yes, I also thought it was a fun comment but I re-read it a few times and it seems like it may be serious. not kidding! i never remember encountering the fallboard when i used to play all day on acoustics. but if the visible key lengths are all the same on digital and acoustic grands then <shrug> disregard was not referring to the pivot lengths, which i don't really notice when practicing
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Joined: Aug 2016
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We've gone off topic rather quickly! But visible key length IS something to keep in mind for acoustics. I think all new pianos are now "standard length" and standard width, with the only real variability being black key width, but for buyers of used and rebuilt pianos, there have been some with shorter keys (I think mainly vintage American pianos like older Baldwins). That's of course neither here nor there for OP as it applies to neither AG nor NV When I was reading Heddy's comment, I thought the same as CG (that he was talking about the visible key length), but it could be interpreted either way.
Bosendorfer D214VC ENPro
Past: Yamaha P-85, P-105, CP50, Kawai MP11, Kawai NV10
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Joined: Jun 2013
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Well, yes, I also thought it was a fun comment but I re-read it a few times and it seems like it may be serious. not kidding! i never remember encountering the fallboard when i used to play all day on acoustics. but if the visible key lengths are all the same on digital and acoustic grands then <shrug> disregard was not referring to the pivot lengths, which i don't really notice when practicing Just curious, but is it possible that your fingers got longer since switching from ‘acoustics’; hence the excess brushing up against the fallboard? I sure wish my fingers grew a little longer; I’ve been feeding them vitamins and all other sorts of supplements, but last I checked, they’ve actually gotten shorter!
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Joined: Jul 2012
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I sure wish my fingers grew a little longer; I’ve been feeding them vitamins and all other sorts of supplements, but last I checked, they’ve actually gotten shorter! Really not something you want to advertise Pete 
All these years playing and I still consider myself a novice.
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Joined: Aug 2018
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I sure wish my fingers grew a little longer; I’ve been feeding them vitamins and all other sorts of supplements, but last I checked, they’ve actually gotten shorter! Wait, is that supposed to be natural? 
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Joined: Jul 2012
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When has Pete been normal I mean natural LOL
All these years playing and I still consider myself a novice.
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So far I've only see one forum member (Alexander Acosta) complaining about NV10 not having "adaptive release sample" in the N1X thread, and it was actually the deciding factor of him choosing the N1X ( https://forum.pianoworld.com//ubbthr...avantgrand-n1x-hands-on.html#Post3019412). I asked him what kinds of repertoire he is constantly practicing. It turns out that he plays quite advanced classical repertoires like Chopin Ballade and Rach Prelude.
Piano: 1982 NY Steinway Model B, Yamaha AvantGrand N3X
VST(preference in order): VSL Synchron Pianos, Vienna Imperial, Garritan CFX, VI Labs Modern U, Ivory II American Concert D, Pianoteq
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Joined: Jun 2013
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When has Pete been normal I mean natural LOL 
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To quote his words about NV10: The keyboard is amazing, better than the N1X, but It isn't capable of performing crispy staccatos. I tried it all when trying both the N1X and the Novus. From Chopin Ballade op 23, to Rachmaninov Op 23 No 5, Some Chopin Nocturnes then when for random things like trills, octaves, staccatos. Repeated notes going from PPP to FFF and vice-versa, heavy harmonics, loud notes, dissonances, etc. I think the Staccatos thing is because of the lack of key off. I found that it sounded as if the dampers took to much time to silence the strings after I had lift my fingers from the keys. I'm guessing that Playing "Pantalón et Colombie" from Carnaval Op 9 would sound rather bizarre.
Piano: 1982 NY Steinway Model B, Yamaha AvantGrand N3X
VST(preference in order): VSL Synchron Pianos, Vienna Imperial, Garritan CFX, VI Labs Modern U, Ivory II American Concert D, Pianoteq
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Joined: Jul 2012
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So what you are telling me, I will never notice the NV10 not having the release samples.
All these years playing and I still consider myself a novice.
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Joined: May 2001
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Hoping this thread will get back on topic since I need a lot of help. I will eventually be able to check out the Avantgrand models at the NYC(where I live)dealership, although not very soon because of the virus. Does anyone know of any dealers that have the Kawai Novus is the NYC area, Manhattan being my first choice? Thanks.
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Joined: Jul 2012
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I tried the N1x in my area and was like wow this instrument is fantastic. I hear you on being in lockdown. I want to check out the new Yamaha CLP-745 for my budget and my local store still doesn't have one on display. They told me early November they should have the new models on display. Really either piano would probably be fine for you but there's something about experiencing the touch of these monster that will most likely have you leaning towards one.
Peace
All these years playing and I still consider myself a novice.
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Joined: Sep 2014
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I'm having the same problems getting to play either one of these pianos live (covid), and my choice is coming down to one of these two as well. I think I'm going to have to play them for myself to know which one suits me better. The NV5 sounds great in online reviews but it has an upright action, which is pretty much a no-go for me.
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