Piano World Home Page Forums Our Most Popular Forums Digital Pianos - Electronic Pianos - Synths & Keyboards Pianoteq 7 has now been released

Has Pianoteq switched to being a sampled instrument now? Spirio is the Steinway equivalent of the Yamaha Disklavier, i.e. a player-piano system that uses solenoids and it's useful for creating automated sampling sessions of multiple velocity layers. Why would you model a piano VST after Spirio which is a mechanical system that has nothing to do with its sound? What have they modeled after it? The solenoid noises?

I'm confused... But it's a welcome addition for Pianoteq to stop modeling and instead switch to sampling 😉

Funny! But I wouldn't count on it ...If Pianoteq switched to sampling then it would sound like a piano ... and they've consistently shown that they don't want that!

I guess the modulation parameters are fine-tuned by comparison with a recording... this explain the Bechstein DIGITAL grand instrument (why trying to record a Bechstein when Bechstein has already done the job).

The Spirio can help Modartt record the Model D.

So I just upgraded to Stage 7 for a fair 29€ and indeed, some of the distinct pianoteq-ness is gone. I immediately compared to my VSL Bösendorfer Imperial and while it doesn't sound quite as natural, it's certainly more pleasant and warm than before.
Need to play with it a bit but I immediately felt more connected to the instrument than before.

The upgrade is not groundbreaking but worth the money in my opinion.

I'll have to check it out tonight and see what it has to offer.

Why these drums in the intro video? Are they afraid to let Pianoteq 7 stand on it's own?

Don't tell me that MacMacMac, the notorious PT hater, will be the first to try it ...
Trying it now.

But first, a handful of Tums and a quart of Pepto Bismol.

I was sure you would be interested. Perhaps the v7 will be the good version, perhaps not !

And if you purchased or updated your license less than a year ago, it is free!!!. I upgraded to standard in August 2020 so I am just installing it

It's the exact same story for me, and I just downloaded it and played it for a while. Since buying the Synthogy Studio Grands a month ago, I have virtually not touched Pianoteq, so direct comparisons are a little bit difficult. That said, my first impression is that the new version sounds better. Less offensive in a way.

But, as usual, when there is a change to their model, my presets need work. Hopefully not too much.

I'm sure you won't 3M. You will find something to not like about it which is fine. It is your constant bashing of the product where I disagree with you. Say it is not your taste and leave it alone.
Not to much to ask IMHO.

I'll see what I think when I get home tonight if I'm not to tired. I really thought they would of had a iPad version coming out with the release of version 7.

I'll probably wait till the next Winter : )

i just upgraded for free, and i love the new Model D options.

That New York D sounds interesting, I'll need to hear more before I can say if it's convincing enough...

That New York D sounds interesting, I'll need to hear more before I can say if it's convincing enough. I've been watching Pianoteq for sometime, but so far I'm not tempted by it due to sounding synthetic.

I've just had a brilliant idea - Modartt developers, I hope you are reading this...!!!!!!!!

Many years ago, it was me, propianist, who suggested to Niclas Fogwall about making the parameter edits note by note using a "graphic equalizer" with 88 sliders, rather than single global control, and this idea was successfully adopted into Pianoteq Pro.

Here's my new idea...

The Sound Recording mode allows almost infinite variable positioning of the virtual mics, any position in virtual 3D space (X,Y,Z coordinates and aiming any orientation angle.)
More importantly, the same 3D freedom is allowed for the virtual "headphones" in binaural model.

Now, those of you who've ever tried a Sony PlayStation PSVR or Oculus Rift virtual reality headset, will know that you experience a much more convincing illusion of tangible 3D "reality" from the live head motion-tracking virtual reality experience, than you ever feel before from simply looking at flat "fixed" 3D stereoscopic photographs, or holograms, or even a "moving but still fixed" 3D stereoscopic video (like watching 3D Blu Ray) although it's motion video with a changing viewpoint perspective, your own natural human head movements (the way you instinctively interact with the world around you) have no effect on the "fixed" perspective the director is showing you in the 3D movie. Without that sensory feedback loop you still remain disconnected from the truly convincing immersive experience.

Now, suppose there was a way of combining live head-tracking for your stereo headphones as you play Pianoteq in binaural mode, whereby the movements of your own head could be mapped and applied in real time to reposition the virtual "headphones" of Pianoteq's binaural sound recording 3D modelling of the acoustic environment. Then, I believe, the grand piano would "appear" before you as an almost tangible 3D sound source. As you lean in closer, things get louder, as you bend to the right or left, you hear the treble or bass keys more closely. You could even stand up from your stool and lean forward putting you head inside the lid, over the strings and hammers, like you can with a real grand piano (lid open) and hear their vivid brightness, feel their proximity.

I think the same user experience quantum leap up going from "fixed" stereoscopic 3D photos and video, to totally immersive motion-tracked 3D stereoscopic virtual reality, could be an equally impressive quantum leap forward in the "sonic virtual reality" and our holy grail quest of trying to reproduce the feeling and sonic experience of sitting in front of a Steinway D concert grand piano.
I now think, lack of head motion tracking, is probably the stumbling block why playing digital pianos always feels fake, whereas real acoustic pianos actually exist in front of you.
Pianists play with huge expression and body language, rolling their torso and shoulders around, wild head movements, etc. - we're hardly ever sitting still, static and locked in one place. Our ears therefore perceive an ever changing stereoscopic sound perspective, which even with binaural HRTF recordings is not captured by one stationary fixed mic position.

This idea is not easy to implement and test, because obviously the required hardware is not commonplace.
Beyerdynamic Headzone Pro was on manufacturer's attempt at head-tracking headphones, but I can't think of many others... (off the top of my head, haha)
...although millions of people (including pianists like me) already do own VR headsets like PSVR and the 3D stereo Playstation cameras which connect via USB. Maybe we can use or adapt the existing hardware somehow? Perhaps the host computer could use a 3D camera like that and track motion if people stuck a few high-vis stickers onto their headphones(!) or perhaps you could just use your PSVR or Oculus headset while you play Pianoteq, and to that end, it would be great to have a 3D rendered Steinway D image in front of you too!

I'm sure this is the way forward, folks.
There are people out there who do know a lot about VR and head tracking and the cameras and technology for VR. It wouldn't take much genius to apply the same tech to a stereo audio only experience, with motion tracking of the virtual binaural piano model that Pianoteq already has. The question is, can the Pianoteq 3D coordinate parameters be manipulated live in real-time without causing audible glitches? Does Pianoteq need to pause and recalculate a new mathematical model for each new 3D position? Or could it just track the motion (perhaps using some 3rd party hardware that could turn the motion tracking into a stream of MIDI data which feeds Pianoteq's parameters, and maybe update the position 25 times a second (every 40ms) like video 25fps can fool the eye, maybe 25fps positional data update can fool the ear too, and Pianoteq could somehow update the maths model every 40ms with new positional data, or smoothly morph between the data values?

I'm sure this is the way forward, somebody needs to look into it, please... it's gotta be worth someone building a prototype and seeing how it feels to play a virtual piano with Virtual Binural Reality.

propianist

Sounds really quite interesting. I think it is a good idea, but as you said, it will be really difficult to get the right tools to do this. For example, what about people who play with speakers.
Or people who have very expensive headphones. I would like to test such a scenario to be able to decide what is more worth: Excellent sound quality or the feeling of being immersed. (Both would be perfect, obviously). I think the former is also really quite important. So if I could be immersed, if the headphones are bad it's still a question what feels better. I wouldn't want to exchange my Beyerdynamic T1 now so easily to be honest. And that's what Pianoteq would have also to consider. The question also is, how many people would use it. It seems like a good idea, but often technologies have been good ideas (only, sadly) and still died at some point because something else won.

I think 88 controls on a piano is quite enough. Beyond that ... if the makers can't set up the VST to sound reasonable with a preset or two or three then they haven't done their job properly.

If there need be more controls, then let the designers tweak them to produce a good result. Then freeze that result and call it a preset.
It's been done before. Less is better.

In general, engineers don't do a good job of meeting the users' needs. They need users (or in this case, artists) on the team to advise them.

I don't direct this point solely at Pianoteq. It's a general mantra of the usability community.