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Hello,

Originally Posted by Bellicapelli
mock him about that

The poor soul 😀.

As said, to me the FP-10 turned out as the better alternative.

But if I'd buy one of these as a standalone ready-to-go instrument, I might like the ES110's sounds better, and would hope I'd be able to accept/tolerate the slight bounciness of the keys that @MoltoDiletante also refers to.

And I love the F-10H pedal that Kawai includes with the ES110 (if that is so in all markets). So much so in fact, that I bought one of those pedals separately and DIYed an alternative way to hook it up to my setup (because it is only compatible with the ES110 and a selection of other Kawai models).

Consider and decide well, good luck, let us know how it turns out!

Cheers,

HZ

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Hi, I've got the es110, and the thing to understand about its light action is that it plays soooo responsively, I feel absolutely 'pianistic' on it, from the softest to the loudest.

Note, that the internal speakers are not bad, but they're not great either. A bit lacking in volume for me and overall clarity and bass. Was a huge upgrade in sound getting the ES920 (though I like the action better on the es110). And, it has but one piano sample, though you can alter that sound a bit, like mellow/brightness settings. I liked it's piano sound.

If by chance your budget swells a bit, you might look at the es520. It's got the lovely action of the es110 but is the second generation, so a bit more refined, not quite as light I've heard. Plus the es520 has decent to good onboard speakers, big step up from the es110.

In considering the Rolands, make sure you're getting advice on the new X models, apparently they've dramatically improved their sound because of a new chip.

Last edited by Randyman; 04/22/21 03:10 PM.

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Hi,

Can a second hand Korg-SP-170s at $393 be considered cheap?

Thanks.
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Originally Posted by josh_sounds
Can a second hand Korg-SP-170s at $393 be considered cheap?

It's a low end model.
It's at least 9 years old as a model.
It's was pretty cheap when it was brand new.
Today a comparative Korg model could be the B2 and it's ~$499 as a brand new unit.

I wouldn't say it's cheap. I'd pay the extra $100 and get a brand new B2.

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Originally Posted by clothearednincompo
Originally Posted by josh_sounds
Can a second hand Korg-SP-170s at $393 be considered cheap?

It's a low end model.
It's at least 9 years old as a model.
It's was pretty cheap when it was brand new.
Today a comparative Korg model could be the B2 and it's ~$499 as a brand new unit.

I wouldn't say it's cheap. I'd pay the extra $100 and get a brand new B2.


That's great! A $100 more and you get a the newer hammer action and updated sounds. It's sad though because it still doesn't come with the 1/4 jacks frown


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I bought a used Korg SP250 as a temporary replacement when the key-bed wore out of my Yamaha p80. The RH3 action from Korg is light but responsive. It feels like the Acrosonic upright I grew up playing, only with a bit more thumpy-ness to the keys. I tried out most of the popular stage pianos before settling on a Kawai mp7se. For under 500 euro, the Korg D1 (RH3 action) beats out any Casio, the fp10, fp30, p45, es110, etc. as long as you are okay with a limited feature set and no internal speakers.

If you can find an old sp250, that should be half the price and has pretty decent internal speakers but the internal voices sound very outdated and there is limited connectivity (no USB), so it's not a simple fix to use a VST without external speakers.

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Hi all, looks like i've come across a used - almost unused - roland fp30 in my area. Guy is willing to part with it for 400 euros, perhaps a bit less.

I'm gonna try it ot out in the next days. I have great expectations for the action, perhaps better than Lawai's innthis price range ( i love jard actions ), not sure about the sound, which i can't remember, though it sounds not bad on YouTube reviews.

Would love to find an es110, but Kawai makes no big numbers around here, won't be easy.

I'll keep you posted.


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P.s. how would you rate a 400 eur. price for a good fp30?


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Hello,

If you'd really rather have an ES110, and can't obtain one locally, would this be an option for you?:

https://www.thomann.de/it/kawai_es_110_b.htm

As for that used FP-30, given that you are going to test (thoroughly!) it in person and that you are experienced in piano playing, that might be a nice option. I am not familiar with used FP-30 prices, follow your gut feeling there is what I think. Be sure to really, really like it for your intended use and to trust its condition, when in doubt, walk away.

Good luck!

Cheers and happy decision making,

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It's a discontinued model now and replaced by the somewhat better FP-30X.

I guess the last regular prices for the last FP-30 units were little over 600€. Maybe there were/still are special deals for the last remaining units(?)

So, you save about 200€ by getting a used one.

The FP-30X seems to be around 700€ and not necessarily immediately available everywhere.

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Speaking of gut feeling..

I came across a used Yamaha P-95 at ~$414. Tested it but I felt it is a bit overpriced.
I don't know when the P-95 was released but Kraft music had a review 9 years ago so no USB only midi.
It said it is graded but I couldn't feel the difference unlike in ES110 keybed

Am I right on this P-95? Should I take it?



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Yamaha P-95 isn't very different from the current lowest of the lowend Yamaha P-45 which can be had for ~$499 (U.S. price). With the P-45 you get a few years of warranty. (And the same key action albeit a brand new one.)

Of course if the P-95 comes with e.g. stand and pedals then those are worth something as they are not included in the $499 price of the P-45.

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Originally Posted by HZPiano
Hello,

If you'd really rather have an ES110, and can't obtain one locally, would this be an option for you?:

https://www.thomann.de/it/kawai_es_110_b.htm

As for that used FP-30, given that you are going to test (thoroughly!) it in person and that you are experienced in piano playing, that might be a nice option. I am not familiar with used FP-30 prices, follow your gut feeling there is what I think. Be sure to really, really like it for your intended use and to trust its condition, when in doubt, walk away.

Good luck!

Cheers and happy decision making,

HZ

Yeah, i kept an eye on thomann's offers for some days, thanks. Fact is, ideally I would feel "safer" with Kawai as my "homebrand", but then i never actually played the es110. On the other side, this Roland is available to thoroughly check out, and comes cheaper. So, i'll have to give it a try.


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Hello,

Originally Posted by Bellicapelli
Fact is, ideally I would feel "safer" with Kawai as my "homebrand", but then i never actually played the es110. On the other side, this Roland is available to thoroughly check out, and comes cheaper. So, i'll have to give it a try.

Trying and learning is fun!

Once you have decided, let us know what you chose and why, and how the instrument works out at your lover's address. Is always interesting to know.

Good luck!

Cheers,

HZ

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Originally Posted by clothearednincompo
Yamaha P-95 isn't very different from the current lowest of the lowend Yamaha P-45 which can be had for ~$499 (U.S. price). With the P-45 you get a few years of warranty. (And the same key action albeit a brand new one.)

Of course if the P-95 comes with e.g. stand and pedals then those are worth something as they are not included in the $499 price of the P-45.


Unfortunately, the price is just for the piano only. Same keybeds, got it.
I have just read that P-45 has 2 sensors, this would require full release of the keys to replay the notes.

Thanks for your feedback mate.


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Originally Posted by josh_sounds
I have just read that P-45 has 2 sensors, this would require full release of the keys to replay the notes.
That's true on almost enything you'd find in this price range. Many high end boards have had 2 sensors, too. It's not something that comes into play that often for that many players, so I wouldn't suggest making this a deal-killer.

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It's not a full key release that's required. But triple sensor actions do have some benefits.

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True, not "full" release of the key... just high enough to get above the top sensor. The location of that top sensor is at different places on different boards, so how high you need to raise the key differs. But the note does have to fully release, regardless (unless you have the sustain pedal down). That is, you will not be able to restrike a piano note while the previous strike of that note is still ringing (again, unless the pedal is down). And again, this is not necessarily something of paramount importance. I would take a high quality 2-sensor action over a mediocre 3-sensor.

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Originally Posted by anotherscott
Originally Posted by josh_sounds
I have just read that P-45 has 2 sensors, this would require full release of the keys to replay the notes.
That's true on almost enything you'd find in this price range. Many high end boards have had 2 sensors, too. It's not something that comes into play that often for that many players, so I wouldn't suggest making this a deal-killer.

Hey anotherscott, I see you following me around, hahaha! smile


The 2-sensor was not the deal breaker though, but rather the price at $414.
A little more, at ~$499 I got newer(less used) keyboard action with the P45 as clothearednincompo said.
But even a little more at ~$515 I'd get the escapement feature of the Roland RP30

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Hello, just for an update, the roland fp30 is gone before i could give it a spin. So i'm just back from the shop in Florence, where I could check out the es110, and it was as coming back home, for me as a Kawai owner. It sounds good enough to me ( even though amplification is not up to par with my ca63 ), and the action is lovely to my hands.

I also could try the Casio cdp s1000, and didn't like it much. The sound was not on the same level with the es110 to me, way too brilliant to my ears, and as the action goes ,i felt it too light in front, and too hard on the back, to the point where on a complicated chord, with fingers on the back side of the keys ended up in non sounding notes. It is not bad all in all, nothing i couldn't adjust to if i had to, but being it's cost just 40 euros lower than the kaway, no contest to me. I feel like this casio would be a good choice for around 100 euros less.

The last thing i wish to try out before pulling the trigger is a roland fp30x. I could use a heavy action, and they sound nice on YouTube, but that's another trip to another shop.

Ps. By the way, a shop 100m from my second home is offering me a much cheaper Korg b2. I want to give it a try too.

Last edited by Bellicapelli; 05/16/21 10:02 AM.

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