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#3130016 06/21/21 01:18 PM
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Hi,

I am looking for an ABRSM Piano teacher in the US.

I tried the ABRSM site and could not find a directory.

I was hoping to find a teacher in my area (New Hampshire) or online but prefer face to face if possible.

Can someone suggest where to look?

Thank you.

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Originally Posted by Snowstorm
Hi,

I am looking for an ABRSM Piano teacher in the US.

I tried the ABRSM site and could not find a directory.

I was hoping to find a teacher in my area (New Hampshire) or online but prefer face to face if possible.

Can someone suggest where to look?
Did you consider contacting each piano teacher in your area (which you should be able to find from a directory of piano teachers, like https://pianoteachersdirectory.com/location/united-states/new-hampshire/ ), and asking them directly by email or phone whether they do ABRSM?

If they haven't heard of ABRSM (which most wouldn't), you can stop enquiring any further.

Weren't you doing RCM before, and if so, is there a particular reason you want to switch to ABRSM (which is little known in North America)?


"I don't play accurately - anyone can play accurately - but I play with wonderful expression. As far as the piano is concerned, sentiment is my forte. I keep science for Life."
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You can also search by location through mtna.org (National music teacher’s association)


"Music, rich, full of feeling, not soulless, is like a crystal on which the sun falls and brings forth from it a whole rainbow" - F. Chopin
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I suggest any competent teacher could prepare you for the ABRSM exams. They will have covered all aspects of the musical content one way or another if they have been properly trained.

Teachers in your area may not be familiar with the name but if you download the requirements to show them it will be clear that the path is a standard one. There’s lots of practice material available too from the organisation.

You would just have to agree the appropriate level with your teacher.

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Originally Posted by terentius
I suggest any competent teacher could prepare you for the ABRSM exams. They will have covered all aspects of the musical content one way or another if they have been properly trained.
I very much doubt it, based on the posts I've seen from other teachers here over the years.

Hardly any teacher spends any time on aural training, if they don't follow any syllabus (RCM, ABRSM, AMEB)........and some don't even teach scales & arpeggios. It's all about teaching pieces - often 'songs' that the student likes.

And this applies especially to teaching adult students.

That doesn't mean they can't teach following the requirements of ABRSM, of course, but if the student isn't actually doing the exams, he might not know how well he has been taught.

The student recitals organised by most teachers in the US just show the students' ability to play pieces. And some have even been taught those pieces by rote.


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You could try contacting a local university, and seeing if someone is up to the task. Also, if you're lucky, you might find a college student who happens to be a good teacher.

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Hardly any teacher spends any time on aural training, if they don't follow any syllabus (RCM, ABRSM, AMEB)........and some don't even teach scales & arpeggios. It's all about teaching pieces - often 'songs' that the student likes.

And this applies especially to teaching adult students.

How do you know 'hardly any teacher spends time on aural training'? You really should try teaching an adult learner before making sweeping remarks.

As for the emphasis on teaching pieces, I think when you look at the ABRSM syllabus and see that the pieces carry 90 marks and the aural just 18 - you begin to understand where one's priorities lie. It says more about the ABRSM system than it does a teacher.

Quote
That doesn't mean they can't teach following the requirements of ABRSM, of course, but if the student isn't actually doing the exams, he might not know how well he has been taught.

How a student does in an exam is not necessarily a reflection on how they've been taught. There are many factors than can influence how an exam is marked and how a students performs in an exam situation.


Quote
The student recitals organised by most teachers in the US just show the students' ability to play pieces. And some have even been taught those pieces by rote

Many students who sit ABRSM exams learn by rote too. In my experience, this approach is often used where the emphasis falls on 'passing grades', rather than a slower, more holistic approach to music learning. This pressure often comes from other factors such as: parents, peers or high-expectations.

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Originally Posted by fatar760
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Hardly any teacher spends any time on aural training, if they don't follow any syllabus (RCM, ABRSM, AMEB)........and some don't even teach scales & arpeggios. It's all about teaching pieces - often 'songs' that the student likes.

And this applies especially to teaching adult students.

How do you know 'hardly any teacher spends time on aural training'? You really should try teaching an adult learner before making sweeping remarks.
Instead of making snide remarks (not for the first time), try to read my posts carefully and take them on board.

I'm basing my comment on what I've been reading in posts here in Piano Teachers Forum and ABF over the past twelve years. Why don't you do the same before jumping down my throat, for once?

And I'm not talking about piano teaching in the UK, though some teachers here who specialise in adult beginners do much the same with their adult students: if students tell them what they want to learn, the teachers teach what they want to learn. Otherwise the students will go elsewhere.



Quote
As for the emphasis on teaching pieces, I think when you look at the ABRSM syllabus and see that the pieces carry 90 marks and the aural just 18 - you begin to understand where one's priorities lie. It says more about the ABRSM system than it does a teacher.
Of course there is a lot more marks for pieces than for aurals and sight-reading and scales & arpeggios. It is a piano exam.

But you're talking through your hat when you claim that a student who cannot read music at all and has no aural skills can pass any grade exam with flying colours.

Why do you teach ABRSM at all, if you're so critical of it? Is it because your students want to do the exams, and you acquiesce because you need their money? Are you actually teaching them properly - as per the ABRSM's ethos (- go to their website and read it)? If all you're doing is to teach them to pass the exams as quickly as possible, you're doing them - and yourself - no favours.

When I compare what I - and all my fellow students, when I was a student myself as a kid - learnt in terms of overall musical skills that enabled me to sight-sing (and thus join a choir that performed regularly and won national and international competitions), play in ensemble, conduct, compose, make arrangements etc - all just from learning piano and going through the grades like everyone else, I thank my lucky stars that I was taught (by my first three teachers in two different countries) following the syllabus. I have been a member of several ad-hoc choirs as an adult, and everyone in those choirs can sight-sing, yet none of them ever had singing lessons. The only thing they had in common was that they'd been through the grades on their instruments - piano, string, woodwind, brass. I used to take that for granted, until I discovered here in PW that actually, most teachers who don't use a syllabus (which is almost all teachers here) only teach pieces. Aural skills, theory, sight-reading, often even scales & arpeggios are not part of their teaching.

I strongly advise you to stop teaching ABRSM to any more of your students, as they will pick up on your vibes about its "shortcomings" as you deem them. (I deem them your shortcomings.) You can devise your own syllabus - far superior to ABRSM, I'm sure...... smirk


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Originally Posted by bennevis
Originally Posted by fatar760
Quote
Hardly any teacher spends any time on aural training, if they don't follow any syllabus (RCM, ABRSM, AMEB)........and some don't even teach scales & arpeggios. It's all about teaching pieces - often 'songs' that the student likes.

And this applies especially to teaching adult students.

How do you know 'hardly any teacher spends time on aural training'? You really should try teaching an adult learner before making sweeping remarks.
Instead of making snide remarks (not for the first time), try to read my posts carefully and take them on board.

I'm basing my comment on what I've been reading in posts here in Piano Teachers Forum and ABF over the past twelve years. Why don't you do the same before jumping down my throat, for once?

And I'm not talking about piano teaching in the UK, though some teachers here who specialise in adult beginners do much the same with their adult students: if students tell them what they want to learn, the teachers teach what they want to learn. Otherwise the students will go elsewhere.



Quote
As for the emphasis on teaching pieces, I think when you look at the ABRSM syllabus and see that the pieces carry 90 marks and the aural just 18 - you begin to understand where one's priorities lie. It says more about the ABRSM system than it does a teacher.
Of course there is a lot more marks for pieces than for aurals and sight-reading and scales & arpeggios. It is a piano exam.

But you're talking through your hat when you claim that a student who cannot read music at all and has no aural skills can pass any grade exam with flying colours.

Why do you teach ABRSM at all, if you're so critical of it? Is it because your students want to do the exams, and you acquiesce because you need their money? Are you actually teaching them properly - as per the ABRSM's ethos (- go to their website and read it)? If all you're doing is to teach them to pass the exams as quickly as possible, you're doing them - and yourself - no favours.

When I compare what I - and all my fellow students, when I was a student myself as a kid - learnt in terms of overall musical skills that enabled me to sight-sing (and thus join a choir that performed regularly and won national and international competitions), play in ensemble, conduct, compose, make arrangements etc - all just from learning piano and going through the grades like everyone else, I thank my lucky stars that I was taught (by my first three teachers in two different countries) following the syllabus. I have been a member of several ad-hoc choirs as an adult, and everyone in those choirs can sight-sing, yet none of them ever had singing lessons. The only thing they had in common was that they'd been through the grades on their instruments - piano, string, woodwind, brass. I used to take that for granted, until I discovered here in PW that actually, most teachers who don't use a syllabus (which is almost all teachers here) only teach pieces. Aural skills, theory, sight-reading, often even scales & arpeggios are not part of their teaching.

I strongly advise you to stop teaching ABRSM to any more of your students, as they will pick up on your vibes about its "shortcomings" as you deem them. (I deem them your shortcomings.) You can devise your own syllabus - far superior to ABRSM, I'm sure...... smirk

Oh dear. More assumptions.

I did read your post carefully - I had to when I was quoting you. It seems like if someone disagrees with your comments then they 'haven't read your post correctly'. No, I'm just disagreeing with you - and not in a snide way, I was quite direct.

I no longer enter students into ABRSM exams - shame you assumed I did before posting diatribe.

As for claiming 'i'm talking through my hat' regarding a student who passed with three distinctions. You have no basis to dismiss that this happened. None at all.

She was a 11 year old student who had passed her Grade 1 - 3 piano exams with distinction. I saw the marking sheets for each exam. In her three years of learning (yeh she went straight into the exam syllabus), she'd learnt just 9 pieces. There were note names on each note. She didn't know the C Major Scale and couldn't sight-read at that level.

FYI - my students used to pass their Grade 1 theory before we looked at the practical exams, which was a long process but set a solid foundation.

You should perhaps be a little more inquisitive before passing judgement of others.

I'd like to remind you that in the PW Rules, it states:

"Discuss what has been said, not the person who said it. Feel free to disagree, even strongly, with something someone has said but note that they're as entitled to their opinion as you are and just because they don't share your opinion doesn't mean they're wrong or deserving of abuse."

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Originally Posted by fatar760
Oh dear. More assumptions.

I did read your post carefully - I had to when I was quoting you. It seems like if someone disagrees with your comments then they 'haven't read your post correctly'. No, I'm just disagreeing with you - and not in a snide way, I was quite direct.
So, you have actually read my post carefully, yet didn't get my message - that I was basing my comment on posts in PW? Did you read through past posts here from other teachers, and the experiences of students in ABF? If you have, you'd know I am saying things as they really are, not just giving my "opinion".

Dear, dear, dear..... smirk




Quote
She was a 11 year old student who had passed her Grade 1 - 3 piano exams with distinction. I saw the marking sheets for each exam. In her three years of learning (yeh she went straight into the exam syllabus), she'd learnt just 9 pieces. There were note names on each note. She didn't know the C Major Scale and couldn't sight-read at that level.
Yes, you keep repeating that to bash ABRSM. In fact, I remember you said that before, a few years ago.

But the strange thing is, you never say what marks that student got in sight-reading, scales & arpeggios and aurals, even though I asked you before, more than once. Did she pass them? If she did, how?




Quote
"Discuss what has been said, not the person who said it. Feel free to disagree, even strongly, with something someone has said but note that they're as entitled to their opinion as you are and just because they don't share your opinion doesn't mean they're wrong or deserving of abuse."
I respond to people exactly as they write, in my own direct way.

What was that you directed at me?
Quote
How do you know 'hardly any teacher spends time on aural training'? You really should try teaching an adult learner before making sweeping remarks.
If you want to keep attacking me personally, and what I write - which are based on fact -, perhaps do that in private, via PM? There's other stuff you've posted recently which, because they weren't directed at me, I didn't get involved in. Unlike you, with my posts here responding to someone else - and you jumped in with your first post directly attacking me.

There are a lot of things I'd like to say to you - directly -, but I refrain......


I'll look forward to your PMs, if you do want to continue pursuing this.


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Originally Posted by bennevis
Originally Posted by fatar760
Oh dear. More assumptions.

I did read your post carefully - I had to when I was quoting you. It seems like if someone disagrees with your comments then they 'haven't read your post correctly'. No, I'm just disagreeing with you - and not in a snide way, I was quite direct.
So, you have actually read my post carefully, yet didn't get my message - that I was basing my comment on posts in PW? Did you read through past posts here from other teachers, and the experiences of students in ABF? If you have, you'd know I am saying things as they really are, not just giving my "opinion".

Dear, dear, dear..... smirk




Quote
She was a 11 year old student who had passed her Grade 1 - 3 piano exams with distinction. I saw the marking sheets for each exam. In her three years of learning (yeh she went straight into the exam syllabus), she'd learnt just 9 pieces. There were note names on each note. She didn't know the C Major Scale and couldn't sight-read at that level.
Yes, you keep repeating that to bash ABRSM. In fact, I remember you said that before, a few years ago.

But the strange thing is, you never say what marks that student got in sight-reading, scales & arpeggios and aurals, even though I asked you before, more than once. Did she pass them? If she did, how?




Quote
"Discuss what has been said, not the person who said it. Feel free to disagree, even strongly, with something someone has said but note that they're as entitled to their opinion as you are and just because they don't share your opinion doesn't mean they're wrong or deserving of abuse."
I respond to people exactly as they write, in my own direct way.

What was that you directed at me?
Quote
How do you know 'hardly any teacher spends time on aural training'? You really should try teaching an adult learner before making sweeping remarks.
If you want to keep attacking me personally, and what I write - which are based on fact -, perhaps do that in private, via PM? There's other stuff you've posted recently which, because they weren't directed at me, I didn't get involved in. Unlike you, with my posts here responding to someone else - and you jumped in with your first post directly attacking me.

There are a lot of things I'd like to say to you - directly -, but I refrain......

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You can mark me down as an exception: I did not sit for any exams as a kid, but I had two piano lessons per week: one for repertoire and the second for theory and ear training. To my knowledge, my teacher did not participate in the exam system.

I honestly don’t see how all of this could be taught well in one lesson per week— but I have never taught.


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I'm not attacking you personally at all. You stated you don't teach adult learners and I, and others, said you really should before making judgements.

You didn't ask me about my previous students markings. If you had I'd have answered. If you asked years ago, then no, I don't have the time to go trawling through posts - who does?

This student was around 08/09 and I cannot recall her individual markings from each of her three exams. I doubt many teachers could. To get over 130 marks I'd suggest her markings in these areas were high.

I have no desire to 'continue' anything with you via PM or otherwise, particularly as you seem to evade questions and leap down someone's throat when they disagree with you (and people WILL disagree with you), how you choose to respond is a choice, and your responses don't invite an open dialogue - in fact your penultimate was quite aggressive.

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Originally Posted by dogperson
You can mark me down as an exception: I did not sit for any exams as a kid, but I had two piano lessons per week: one for repertoire and the second for theory and ear training. To my knowledge, my teacher did not participate in the exam system.

I honestly don’t see how all of this could be taught well in one lesson per week— but I have never taught.

It depends on the length of the lesson and the age of the student, I think.

I used to find that students who were taught twice a week, for maybe 30-45 mins a time, progressed much quicker than those who had one 60 min lesson a week. I think mostly because it meant they had to sit at the piano more than once a week ha!

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Originally Posted by bennevis
Originally Posted by Snowstorm
Hi,

I am looking for an ABRSM Piano teacher in the US.

I tried the ABRSM site and could not find a directory.

I was hoping to find a teacher in my area (New Hampshire) or online but prefer face to face if possible.

Can someone suggest where to look?
Did you consider contacting each piano teacher in your area (which you should be able to find from a directory of piano teachers, like https://pianoteachersdirectory.com/location/united-states/new-hampshire/ ), and asking them directly by email or phone whether they do ABRSM?

If they haven't heard of ABRSM (which most wouldn't), you can stop enquiring any further.

Weren't you doing RCM before, and if so, is there a particular reason you want to switch to ABRSM (which is little known in North America)?

That is correct, I am doing the RCM program and I have decided to stay with the program and my teacher.

I like the program and I like my teacher.

I was wondering how it would be to do in person lessons, never done that before.

I was naive and thought maybe there would be more ABRSM teachers in my area but that is not the case.

Just like RCM, I would have to find an ABRSM teacher online, it would defeat the purpose and like I said I like my teacher and the program.

I appreciate everyone help.

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Originally Posted by Snowstorm
Originally Posted by bennevis
Originally Posted by Snowstorm
Hi,

I am looking for an ABRSM Piano teacher in the US.

I tried the ABRSM site and could not find a directory.

I was hoping to find a teacher in my area (New Hampshire) or online but prefer face to face if possible.

Can someone suggest where to look?
Did you consider contacting each piano teacher in your area (which you should be able to find from a directory of piano teachers, like https://pianoteachersdirectory.com/location/united-states/new-hampshire/ ), and asking them directly by email or phone whether they do ABRSM?

If they haven't heard of ABRSM (which most wouldn't), you can stop enquiring any further.

Weren't you doing RCM before, and if so, is there a particular reason you want to switch to ABRSM (which is little known in North America)?

That is correct, I am doing the RCM program and I have decided to stay with the program and my teacher.

I like the program and I like my teacher.

I was wondering how it would be to do in person lessons, never done that before.

I was naive and thought maybe there would be more ABRSM teachers in my area but that is not the case.

Just like RCM, I would have to find an ABRSM teacher online, it would defeat the purpose and like I said I like my teacher and the program.

I appreciate everyone help.

Have you tried the ABRSM Teacher's Forum? You may have some joy there:

https://forums.abrsm.org/index.php?showforum=2

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Actually, I did.

After three days, I am still waiting to get approve to post.

So far, there is less overall bs with RCM than ABRSM.

You can go on the RCM website with an actual directory with teachers contact/info and contact them from there.

No login needed.

I'm going to stick with RCM for now, but thank you.

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Originally Posted by Snowstorm
Actually, I did.

After three days, I am still waiting to get approve to post.

So far, there is less overall bs with RCM than ABRSM.

You can go on the RCM website with an actual directory with teachers contact/info and contact them from there.

No login needed.

I'm going to stick with RCM for now, but thank you.

I wonder if there's some issue with ABRSM at the moment.

If you'd like me to post something there on your behalf just PM me - sounds like you're onto a good thing with RCM though smile

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I use the ABRSM forums regularly. I do seem to remember new members moaning sometimes that it took a few days to register to post.
However, I'm almost certain they don't have a register of teachers as such. If you're still interested you could contact your nearest rep in the US who might be able to help.
https://us.abrsm.org/en/exam-booking/local-exam-contacts/

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Yep, did that too.

I contacted the one from MA and I got a voicemail with a voicemail full.

That's when I decided to post here.

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Originally Posted by Snowstorm
I am doing the RCM program and I have decided to stay with the program and my teacher.

I like the program and I like my teacher.

I was wondering how it would be to do in person lessons, never done that before.

I was naive and thought maybe there would be more ABRSM teachers in my area but that is not the case.

Just like RCM, I would have to find an ABRSM teacher online, it would defeat the purpose and like I said I like my teacher and the program.
I think that's the best course for you, as you're happy with RCM. If you don't do exams, there's practically no difference anyway. (For RCM, you'd have to memorize your exam pieces, which you don't for ABRSM).

There are many similarities between RCM and ABRSM, but ABRSM is internationally widely known and used in many countries around the world. RCM is Canadian, and the vast majority of American teachers (and students) shun it, but at least, there are a few teachers who know about it in the US.

A structured approach to learning like the RCM and ABRSM is the best way for classically-minded students to ensure they get taught everything they need, or will need in the future for their musical explorations. Otherwise, it's entirely down to the teacher's expertise - and whims.......(and I've read a lot of strange methods from other teachers here - including teaching students only the teacher's own compositions, jumping from one disparate thing to another, or never checking that the student can actually read music because they always play every piece for the student, who simply copies the teacher note by note.)

In person lessons are always better, if you can get them.


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Originally Posted by fatar760
I'm not attacking you personally at all. You stated you don't teach adult learners and I, and others, said you really should before making judgements.
Yet again....sigh.

Do I need to repeat - what I said is fact, not my "judgment"?
Fact based on what teachers and students wrote in PW.

Quote
This student was around 08/09 and I cannot recall her individual markings from each of her three exams. I doubt many teachers could. To get over 130 marks I'd suggest her markings in these areas were high.
In which case, evidently, someone else did the exam for her.

It won't be the first time this has happened in a practical exam, where the examiner doesn't know what the student looks like.
Quote
I have no desire to 'continue' anything with you via PM or otherwise, particularly as you seem to evade questions and leap down someone's throat when they disagree with you (and people WILL disagree with you), how you choose to respond is a choice, and your responses don't invite an open dialogue - in fact your penultimate was quite aggressive.
I call a spade a spade, not a gardening tool.


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ABRSM grade level 4-
2 Alto clef (C clef centred on 3rd line). Notes in the alto clef in
any of the keys set for this grade (see below). Notes of the
same pitch written in different clefs (treble, alto, bass) and
transposition at the octave from the treble or the bass clef
to the alto clef, and vice versa....

Why the Alto Clef? I understand having a quick look at it, but playing on it?

As far as teaching,

I tell my students that I want them to see it, say it, read it, play it, write it, etc.... So, most of what is on the exam from the ABRSM theory syllabus, my students do get depending on their level and practice.

My "trick"- the last page in each book (lesson, theory, tech/art, performance...or a piece I give them) I tell them, I am NOT going to show you anything about this piece. Scan it now, and talk to me about what you see. You MUST sort it out ON YOUR OWN and play it WELL in order to receive a book prize and promote to the next level.

The prizes are fun trinkets and small colorful office supplies and the kids are thrilled to accomplish completing a book level!

And, I am thrilled that they are learning.

Just be nice and teach well.


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Knowledge of the alto clef at ABRSM G4 Theory is I think a recent introduction, since these exams went totally online only this year. (G6-8 can still be taken in paper form.) So some things which were previously in but are not easily marked in an online format, e.g. writing an answering phrase to a given phrase, were replaced with questions that have a clear correct or incorrect answer. The Alto clef used to be in the G8 theory paper.
However, like most of the content up to G5 theory, the knowledge required is a very basic understanding of what the clef means and how the notes relate to the treble and bass. It's not rocket science to transpose an octave up or down when you know where middle C is located and where to place the sharps and flats. There is no requirement to perform from it. After all, single clef instrument players who use alto or tenor clefs have to do the majority of written theory work in clefs they don't practice, probably much to their aggravation!

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Originally Posted by missbelle
Why the Alto Clef? I understand having a quick look at it, but playing on it?

I'm assuming that this is the theory part?
I did RCM theory, and in the higher level of rudiments there was alto clef, tenor clef - a bit higher there were transposing instruments, transposing in and out of concert pitch, and more.

Students doing ABRSM (or RCM) theory play all kinds of instruments. Viola students use the alto clef. Other instruments use the tenor clef.

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Fatar, I have long given up on this, but I had the same concerns. The concern comes when someone is looking for advice, and things come across as facts, when they are trying their way.

So in this bit:

Originally Posted by bennevis
Do I need to repeat - what I said is fact, not my "judgment"?
Fact based on what teachers and students wrote in PW.

The statement Fatar responded to had this in the beginning:

Quote
Hardly any teacher spends any time on aural training, if they don't follow any syllabus (RCM, ABRSM, AMEB)........and some don't even teach scales & arpeggios. It's all about teaching pieces - often 'songs' that the student likes.

And this applies especially to teaching adult students.

That doesn't mean they can't teach following the requirements of ABRSM, of course, but if the student isn't actually doing the exams, he might not know how well he has been taught.

The student recitals organised by most teachers in the US just show the students' ability to play pieces. And some have even been taught those pieces by rote.

Yes, there is a preamble about having read things in the forum. Important point: impressions via what one reads on forum are not "fact" about how music is taught. At best, you get a view what those people who decide to write in the forum, decide to write. It may or may not be accurate. It may or may not be representative. Who is NOT writing in, and why? How many people - teachers as well as students - don't bother writing in (anymore)? How many teachers who teach never join any forum? How many of their students.

You cannot know whether, or how much time, teachers spend giving aural training. Literally, you cannot know. None of us can.

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Originally Posted by missbelle
ABRSM grade level 4-

Why the Alto Clef? I understand having a quick look at it, but playing on it?

For most of us there is not a lot of utility. If you also play a brass instrument you need basic familiarity; if you play first trombone in a symphony it may be most of what you see. If you play organ in church i would guess never.

My mother had 7 C clefs and that is how she transposed. So for her it made sense


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Originally Posted by keystring
Fatar, I have long given up on this, but I had the same concerns. The concern comes when someone is looking for advice, and things come across as facts, when they are trying their way.

So in this bit:

Originally Posted by bennevis
Do I need to repeat - what I said is fact, not my "judgment"?
Fact based on what teachers and students wrote in PW.

The statement Fatar responded to had this in the beginning:

Quote
Hardly any teacher spends any time on aural training, if they don't follow any syllabus (RCM, ABRSM, AMEB)........and some don't even teach scales & arpeggios. It's all about teaching pieces - often 'songs' that the student likes.

And this applies especially to teaching adult students.

That doesn't mean they can't teach following the requirements of ABRSM, of course, but if the student isn't actually doing the exams, he might not know how well he has been taught.

The student recitals organised by most teachers in the US just show the students' ability to play pieces. And some have even been taught those pieces by rote.

Yes, there is a preamble about having read things in the forum. Important point: impressions via what one reads on forum are not "fact" about how music is taught. At best, you get a view what those people who decide to write in the forum, decide to write. It may or may not be accurate. It may or may not be representative. Who is NOT writing in, and why? How many people - teachers as well as students - don't bother writing in (anymore)? How many teachers who teach never join any forum? How many of their students.

You cannot know whether, or how much time, teachers spend giving aural training. Literally, you cannot know. None of us can.

Yes, all these claims that I questioned get a personal attack as a response. I found his responses highly defensive and immature, akin to arguing with an arrogant teenager who thinks they know it all. Did he seriously question a student having someone else sit their exam for them on THREE occasions? I'm sorry but you can't have a fruitful conversation with someone demonstrating that logic. We all know it. I've now given up with him too. Fortunately there are plenty of good people here too!

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Originally Posted by fatar760
Yes, all these claims that I questioned get a personal attack as a response. I found his responses highly defensive and immature, akin to arguing with an arrogant teenager who thinks they know it all.
OK, I see you're still at it, attacking me initially with your first post here, then claiming 'innocence'. And now attacking me again.
And you want to continue this in public here, when I - very politely - asked you to keep any further discussion to PMs?

Are you afraid of being shown up for who you are?

Read your own posts. I responded to you in kind, as is my wont.


Quote
Did he seriously question a student having someone else sit their exam for them on THREE occasions?
Have you heard of the saying: "When you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth."? Obviously not. (Look it up to see who said it.)

Are you saying that all the examiners - all three different ones in three different exams - are corrupt, or know nothing about music, that they give very high marks in a sight-reading test to someone who can't read music? Or the whole ABRSM system is corrupt?

Or how about - the same candidate got the same 'stand-in' to do the exams for her, each time?

Which do you think is most likely? Use logic: I assume you have it?

Of course, I'm assuming you are not making the story up.......

Maybe my assumption is incorrect?


"I don't play accurately - anyone can play accurately - but I play with wonderful expression. As far as the piano is concerned, sentiment is my forte. I keep science for Life."
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If the personal attacks continue some people are headed for a vacation, perhaps a permanent one.


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Originally Posted by fatar 76
Yes, all these claims that I questioned get a personal attack as a response.....
This is in response to my post. I'd like to keep diverting the focus to facts and reality, and for none of us to get side-tracked by the rest.

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Originally Posted by keystring
Originally Posted by fatar 76
Yes, all these claims that I questioned get a personal attack as a response.....
This is in response to my post. I'd like to keep diverting the focus to facts and reality, and for none of us to get side-tracked by the rest.

That's correct - thank you Keystring.

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I always tell my friends if you think arguing about politics is bad you haven’t visited a piano forum lately.

Can’t we all just get along? It’s piano folks. THE PIANO!

Seriously what could we possibly be arguing or attacking each other over?

Last edited by Jethro; 06/24/21 09:36 PM.

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Originally Posted by Jethro
Seriously what could we possibly be arguing or attacking each other over?

Ego.


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Thank you for the messages of support, and to Greg for intervening.

I just wanted to let you know, in case some of you weren't aware (like I wasn't), that there is an option to ignore any user that may be causing you grief:

If you click on their name, view profile, and then there's a row of 4 buttons - one of which says 'ignore user'. I activated this for the first time a few days ago and it prohibits you from viewing their posts.

Maybe some of you know about it but, like I say, I didn't know this existed until recently and it isn't particularly obvious until you search for it, so thought I'd mention it.

Peace to all.

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The only problem, you need to be logged on in order for ignore to work (I tried ignoring someone in the past, not anyone form this thread) .

Most of the time I am not logged in, so it does not really work for me.

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Originally Posted by Snowstorm
The only problem, you need to be logged on in order for ignore to work (I tried ignoring someone in the past, not anyone form this thread) .

Most of the time I am not logged in, so it does not really work for me.


How's the teacher search going; any luck yet?

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Fatar760 I sent you a pm a while back.

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Originally Posted by Snowstorm
Fatar760 I sent you a pm a while back.

Hiya,

I'm afraid it didn't reach me - would you mind re-sending?

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