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#3154997 09/09/21 07:17 PM
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Hi, My DP KAWAI MP7SE produce disturbing fortíssimo sound randomly. Some times each 5 minutes, some times works fine by an hour or two, the suddenly TOING. i will suffer a heart attack some day. OK. I ask you to listen
and let me know your opinion.

Thanks.


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Hello Jorge,

It sounds like a key sensor issue.

Please ask your Kawai dealer to resolve this issue under warranty.

Kind regards,
James
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Most likely: dirt or debris under the sensor pad for the offending note. It happens from time to time.

Second most likely: damaged sensor pad.

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Thanks, I forgot to say is not the same key. The problem occurs in F5 as well as in C 4 or G 6 or A 3 not the same key ánd not at the same time. And some times no problem at all by a long time, then suddenly TOING again frown


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The problem is present in any key, not the same key and not at the same time. When it was new it was necessary to change the mother board by an autoriced dealer here in Guatemala but under supervision of Kawai Japan. By a year and a half it works fine but now this. I had a MP6 and allways works flawlessly. But this MP7 makes me so frustrated and disapointed...


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Jorge,

If you haven't done so already, please check the software version of your MP7SE:

https://www.kawai-global.com/support/updates/

Note that the v1.03 software update includes "Improved: Reliability of keyboard action key switch detection." this may or may/not help, but it's worth a try.

If you are still experiencing this issue after updating the software to the latest version and performing a factory reset etc. please contact your dealer for assistance.

Kind regards,
James
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Yes, I do that, Factory reset and update but the problem remains. I already made an appointment in order to check it.

Sadly i don't trust in KAWAI brand anymore.

Thank you a lot.


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Hello Jorge,

how long have you been using this instrument? Did the problem occur from the beginning or only after some time? Are there any other influences, e.g. mechanical stress, temperature or humidity?

According to the current description, I would rather not see the software as the cause. Typically, there is no random probability of occurrence with pure software problems. At least not in rather simple architectures, such as a digital piano. Besides the already mentioned causes, the error could have many other causes, for example "cold solder joints" -> could it be that the noise produced has something to do with the velocity of the keys and thus impulse / vibration? There could also be problems with components, e.g. aged capacitors, or loss of rewritable memory areas in memory modules, oscillating circuits, etc..

But according to the principle of favouring the simplest assumptions and possibilities, the cause would indeed first be sought in defective or dirty sensors, or the circuit network around the sensors.

I wish you good luck and I hope that a solution will be found for you quickly.

Kind regards MBiG

Last edited by MBiG; 09/10/21 12:54 AM.

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Thank you MBIG for your reply. All the tlhings you mentioned are in my mind wondering which is the most probably reason that is affecting my mp7se. As I mentioned I owned the previous MP6 for about five years and never fails. In the same environment I installed my MP7SE but in the very begining it was defective:
. After some discrepances because where I purchased the piano invalidate the warranty because I transport my new piano to Guatemala The autorized distributor of Kawai here in Guatemala replace the mother board and it works fine until now that this new problem occurs.


The change of the MB US$350 PLUS US$ 25 to diagnose the piano.
Now I do not know how much will cost to me to repair my piano.

What should I do repair or think about a new one piano and which one?

I should never sold my MP6. But the MP7SE seems to me so attractive that.......


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Hello Jorge,

Originally Posted by Jorge Ruiz
As I mentioned I owned the previous MP6 for about five years and never fails.

I believe this is simply a case of bad luck, unfortunately. There is nothing inherently wrong with the MP7/MP7SE design that makes it less reliable than the MP6. Perhaps there is an MP4 customer who owned the piano for several years without incident, yet encountered many issues with the MP6 - he/she would likely believe that the MP6 is unreliable.

Originally Posted by Jorge Ruiz
After some discrepances because where I purchased the piano invalidate the warranty because I transport my new piano to Guatemala...

This is standard policy for Kawai instruments - the warranty is only valid within the country in which it was purchased. If a customer purchases an instrument in the US and transports it to Brazil, the customer is obliged to return the instrument to the US in order to receive warranty support. This is why we always advise the customer to purchase from their local dealer/distributor wherever possible.

There is also the possibility of an instrument becoming damaged in transport, which may have been with your MP7SE.

Originally Posted by Jorge Ruiz
The change of the MB US$350 PLUS US$ 25 to diagnose the piano.

It may have been possible for this fee to have been covered by warranty, had you returned the instrument to the country in which it was purchased.

Originally Posted by Jorge Ruiz
What should I do repair or think about a new one piano and which one?

Perhaps you can contact the Kawai distributor in your country again in order to seek assistance.

Kind regards,
James
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Ok, you not only have the "Toing" problem but also completely missing tones and these, it seems to me, occur randomly on the keyboard, right?

A "random" sensor error or an error that occurs randomly on all key sensors is therefore rather unlikely from my point of view. In my opinion, the problem must be "behind" the sensors. -> This assumes that my assumption in the first sentence is correct.

Regarding the repair that has already been done. What was the problem with that? Could it be a consequential fault of the first repair? Unfortunately, I don't know KAWAI`s repair solutions and especially those from the MP7SE to be able to give you a reliable statement.

Can you trace the midi signals?

Kind regards MBIG

Last edited by MBiG; 09/10/21 02:54 AM.

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Originally Posted by MBiG
Ok, you not only have the "Toing" problem but also completely missing tones and these, it seems to me, occur randomly on the keyboard, right?

No, the second video Jorge posted is from October 2019 - this shows the initial issue, which was resolved by a motherboard replacement.

Kind regards,
James
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Ah.... Ok, I misinterpreted this. Thank you for pointing this out.

Kind regards, MBIG


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I had the same problem with my ES8. I purchased contact strips and replace them myself (the DP was out of warranty, only one year here in Brazil). I haven't had this "toing" problem ever since.

FWIW the clicks, one of the reasons I replaced the strips, were back after a few months. I decided to live with them (and never make the mistake of buying Kawai again).

Last edited by EVC2017; 09/10/21 04:43 AM.

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I have fixed several different brands keyboards with that kind of loud notes problem, and almost always were due to faulty contact strips. But, if so, it should happen repetitively on same keys. So, what happens if you keep pressing repetitively, softly, one of the offending keys?. For sure, if it is a mechanical problem, it should fail from time to time. BTW, being triple sensor adds complexity to the possible effects it can have if dirt makes one of them to delay detection (which is what happens when a key sounds louder, as time between sensor detection is translated as velocity)

Only once, on a old Yamaha CLP model, I got a problem which was really random, when some keys sounded too loud but also sometimes the key was wrong (i.e. press C and get F). Then the problem was on the scanning electronics. That was harder to diagnose and fix.

All in all, a MIDI register of what is happening would be useful. You can use MIDI-OX for example. But, again, a repeat playing on one of the offending notes would be my approach to be sure it is a mechanical problem.


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THANK YOU, KAWAI JAMES, YOU ARE NORMALLY THE FIRST TO COMMENT AND SUPPORT WHEN I POST A PROBLEM. I must say that I am aware regarding the issue of guarantees but in my case taxes and freight were worse than paying for the replacement of the mother board, also the seller indicated that he would not claim the guarantee. MP6 or MP7 are not available in Guatemala but it was what I needed in my studio and what I felt I should buy.

I wanted a NORD PIANO 4 but from my experience with the MP6 I opted for the MP7SE which has beautiful sounds better than the MP6.

The reason I am disappointed in the KAWAI brand is a human reason, not a technical one. Bad luck from the beginning and bad luck now frustrates me. This is something that both KAWAI, YAMAHA, CASIO, etc. surely know. not everything is mathematical, there are social and sentimental reasons as well.

THE IMPORTANT: I ​​prefer comments on similar cases, if there are any and how they were resolved, if so. That helps me, although I understand your responsibility to the KAWAI brand.


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Hello Jorge,

Originally Posted by Jorge Ruiz
THE IMPORTANT: I ​​prefer comments on similar cases, if there are any and how they were resolved, if so. That helps me, although I understand your responsibility to the KAWAI brand.

I believe the key sensor switches/PCB are the source of this problem.

I recommend that you should seek assistance from the Kawai distributor in Guatemala, who should be able to purchase the necessary parts and arrange for the replacement, however this will not be covered by warranty for the reasons stated above.

Kind regards,
James
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Originally Posted by Jorge Ruiz
THANK YOU, KAWAI JAMES, YOU ARE NORMALLY THE FIRST TO COMMENT AND SUPPORT WHEN I POST A PROBLEM. I must say that I am aware regarding the issue of guarantees but in my case taxes and freight were worse than paying for the replacement of the mother board, also the seller indicated that he would not claim the guarantee. MP6 or MP7 are not available in Guatemala but it was what I needed in my studio and what I felt I should buy.

I wanted a NORD PIANO 4 but from my experience with the MP6 I opted for the MP7SE which has beautiful sounds better than the MP6.

The reason I am disappointed in the KAWAI brand is a human reason, not a technical one. Bad luck from the beginning and bad luck now frustrates me. This is something that both KAWAI, YAMAHA, CASIO, etc. surely know. not everything is mathematical, there are social and sentimental reasons as well.

THE IMPORTANT: I ​​prefer comments on similar cases, if there are any and how they were resolved, if so. That helps me, although I understand your responsibility to the KAWAI brand.

If your MP7SE belongs to the first batch produced by Kawai, it will have a faulty keybed. The only solution is to change the entire bottom part of your keybed.

PS: I had this issue just under 2 months of purchasing the keyboard.

Kawai must have recalled these keyboards and serviced them free of charge. It's so disappointing to see this still happening. It definitely impacts Kawai's reputation.


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Thanks to all of you. Let me tell you that the loud notes are completly random across the full 88 keys. Velocity aparently impact in the problem, the most I play a secuence of notes the more loud note is produced, for example in CORAZON DE NIÑO the secuence ADFF DFAA FADD PLAYED repeatedly PRODUCES ONE F LOUD NOTE at 5 minutes to start. In KISS THE RAIN the passage AflatCEflatF GGAflatCCBflat played with full pedal produces a G loud note after five or six repetitions. Apparently poliphony affects the more loud notes but I really don't know.

This week my piano will be checked by an authorized KAWAI DISTRIBUTOR. THEN I let you know the result.

Thanks again


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Apparently the technicians don't have any clue on how to repair my MP7SE. They ask for me to give them any idea. Ooooh! My GODnesssss!


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