2022 our 25th year online!

Welcome to the Piano World Piano Forums
Over 3 million posts about pianos, digital pianos, and all types of keyboard instruments.
Over 100,000 members from around the world.
Join the World's Largest Community of Piano Lovers (it's free)
It's Fun to Play the Piano ... Please Pass It On!

SEARCH
Piano Forums & Piano World
(ad)
Who's Online Now
60 members (Animisha, aphexdisklavier, benkeys, 1200s, akse0435, AlkansBookcase, Alex Hutor, AndyOnThePiano2, 13 invisible), 1,862 guests, and 258 robots.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Hop To
Page 1 of 2 1 2
#3157758 09/19/21 05:07 AM
Joined: May 2021
Posts: 10
F
frighg Offline OP
Junior Member
OP Offline
Junior Member
F
Joined: May 2021
Posts: 10
well, im autodidact and i want to listen this interpretations for opinion. thanks




frighg #3157785 09/19/21 08:06 AM
Joined: Feb 2015
Posts: 4,033
4000 Post Club Member
Offline
4000 Post Club Member
Joined: Feb 2015
Posts: 4,033
You have way too much tension in your hands and I can hear that tension even without looking at the video. You need to relax that 5th finger.

To me the general level is too loud. If you were playing on a real piano the neighbours would be knocking at your door. wink Besides lowering the overall dynamics the left hand should be much softer than the right. It is too loud right now.

The right hand is too choppy and not cantabile enough. For example, at 3:23 in the first video you are accenting every note and it doesn't sound good.

The scale runs are notated as small grace notes and should be played very lightly with a feather touch.

Sorry for being critical but it doesn't sound too good and I don't think it will sound good until you can play much more relaxed.

frighg #3157788 09/19/21 08:23 AM
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 36,803
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
Online Content
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 36,803
I listened to your first recording. This is very good for someone who is self taught. I guess my first question is why you don't take piano lessons? With a good teacher you would learn more quickly and a good performance would be even better. Are you using a fingered edition? Much of the time your fingering seemed fine but there were some spots where it seemed very awkward(the section around 1:33 -2:00) and not something a more experienced pianist would usually choose. Do you listen to performances by the great pianists of pieces you are learning?

Last edited by pianoloverus; 09/19/21 08:24 AM.
frighg #3157819 09/19/21 09:58 AM
Joined: Sep 2021
Posts: 104
S
Full Member
Offline
Full Member
S
Joined: Sep 2021
Posts: 104
These are not easy pieces, Kudos for learning everything yourself!

The most common challenges for self-taught pianist are techniques such as using of arm weight, wrist circle and hand rotation. Try to relax your hands, you should not feel much tension while playing, otherwise, you will never play up to speed and produce beautiful tones and articulations. Also your dynamic range will be limited.

Another common misconception is that piano is played only with fingers. Your fingers actually do not have much muscle, what devise your hand movement is Ligament and tendons, through your arm and connecting with your shoulders. One important concept is to leverage arm weight to play more at ease.

I suggest that you try some Hanon exercises, they are really good for building up techniques I mentioned. Here are a few videos may help you.



Last edited by scientistplayspian; 09/19/21 09:59 AM.
frighg #3157822 09/19/21 10:02 AM
Joined: Jul 2017
Posts: 2,598
M
2000 Post Club Member
Offline
2000 Post Club Member
M
Joined: Jul 2017
Posts: 2,598
What is the second piece ? Really nice piece.

frighg #3157824 09/19/21 10:10 AM
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 5,894
D
dmd Offline
5000 Post Club Member
Offline
5000 Post Club Member
D
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 5,894
You reallly need to get a teacher.

I doubt if you can repair your technique without one.

You will think you are fixing it but you will not be successful and the more you play with such tension the more difficult it will be to correct it.


Don

Kawai MP7SE, On Stage KS7350 keyboard stand, KRK Classic 5 powered monitors, SennHeiser HD 559 Headphones
Joined: May 2015
Posts: 12,370
S
PW Gold Subscriber
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
Offline
PW Gold Subscriber
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
S
Joined: May 2015
Posts: 12,370
[quote=scientistplayspian]These are not easy pieces, Kudos for learning everything yourself!

The most common challenges for self-taught pianist are techniques such as using of arm weight, wrist circle and hand rotation. Try to relax your hands, you should not feel much tension while playing, otherwise, you will never play up to speed and produce beautiful tones and articulations. Also your dynamic range will be limited.

Another common misconception is that piano is played only with fingers. Your fingers actually do not have much muscle, what devise your hand movement is Ligament and tendons, through your arm and connecting with your shoulders. One important concept is to leverage arm weight to play more at ease.

I suggest that you try some Hanon exercises, they are really good for building up techniques I mentioned. Here are a few videos may help you.
[/
End of original post

Reply by dogperson
While these tutorials are well done, I do not consider them a good substitute for in-person lessons or an online program that lets you submit videos for review snd comment. In order to eliminate tension you need feedback

Last edited by dogperson; 09/19/21 10:18 AM. Reason: Clarity
frighg #3157849 09/19/21 11:57 AM
Joined: May 2021
Posts: 10
F
frighg Offline OP
Junior Member
OP Offline
Junior Member
F
Joined: May 2021
Posts: 10
Gracias por sus respuestas. lo agradezco enormemente....me encanta tocar y me relaja. la segunda pieza es el nocturno 20 de f.chopin.

frighg #3157851 09/19/21 12:07 PM
Joined: Jul 2017
Posts: 2,598
M
2000 Post Club Member
Offline
2000 Post Club Member
M
Joined: Jul 2017
Posts: 2,598
i know the c sharp nocture but that is the first piece my friend. what was the second ?

frighg #3157864 09/19/21 01:23 PM
Joined: Feb 2015
Posts: 4,033
4000 Post Club Member
Offline
4000 Post Club Member
Joined: Feb 2015
Posts: 4,033
The second one is Chopin nocturne op. 48 no. 2 in F-sharp minor.

frighg #3157909 09/19/21 05:34 PM
Joined: May 2021
Posts: 10
F
frighg Offline OP
Junior Member
OP Offline
Junior Member
F
Joined: May 2021
Posts: 10
tienes razon, los subi al reves : primero es el 20 postumo y segundo el 48 n2....

Last edited by frighg; 09/19/21 05:39 PM.
frighg #3157924 09/19/21 06:09 PM
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 26,906
Gold Subscriber
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
Offline
Gold Subscriber
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 26,906
There is so much tension that is visible in your hands, that I found I could not watch the videos. Musically, you have much to learn about balance, dynamics, voicing and phrasing. These are techniques that are extremely difficult to acquire without the guidance of a good teacher.

Regards,


BruceD
- - - - -
Estonia 190
Joined: Sep 2021
Posts: 104
S
Full Member
Offline
Full Member
S
Joined: Sep 2021
Posts: 104
I have to agree there is no substitution for in-person class. However, for many people in-person is simply too much a luxury.
The concept still could be learned through careful study and examination how other people play.

frighg #3158246 09/21/21 03:47 AM
Joined: Sep 2018
Posts: 366
B
Full Member
Offline
Full Member
B
Joined: Sep 2018
Posts: 366
Originally Posted by BruceD
There is so much tension that is visible in your hands, that I found I could not watch the videos.,
watching the little finger/pinkie in the right hand literally gives me the creeps...
Makes me think of the Aye-Aye

Skip to 0:40
grin

Last edited by brennbaer; 09/21/21 03:50 AM.
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 36,803
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
Online Content
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 36,803
Originally Posted by brennbaer
Originally Posted by BruceD
There is so much tension that is visible in your hands, that I found I could not watch the videos.,
watching the little finger/pinkie in the right hand literally gives me the creeps...
Many great pianists curl the fifth finger when it's not playing. Horowitz does it all the time.

frighg #3158305 09/21/21 09:47 AM
Joined: Apr 2021
Posts: 79
Full Member
Offline
Full Member
Joined: Apr 2021
Posts: 79
It's still freaky.

Joined: Sep 2018
Posts: 366
B
Full Member
Offline
Full Member
B
Joined: Sep 2018
Posts: 366
Originally Posted by pianoloverus
Many great pianists curl the fifth finger when it's not playing. Horowitz does it all the time.
yes, i know.
Also Seymour Bernstein whom i highly admire, does it.

But in this case i'm not just talking about the curling but the pinkie movements in general.
At least to me it just looks, well how can i describe it....? Very special? Very different?
When i was a very little kid i once had this dream where a witch stuck her long curled bony finger through the door's keyhole probing and fumbling with it through my room...
eek grin
Maybe it reminds me of that dream... grin grin

Joined: May 2015
Posts: 12,370
S
PW Gold Subscriber
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
Offline
PW Gold Subscriber
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
S
Joined: May 2015
Posts: 12,370
Originally Posted by pianoloverus
Originally Posted by brennbaer
Originally Posted by BruceD
There is so much tension that is visible in your hands, that I found I could not watch the videos.,
watching the little finger/pinkie in the right hand literally gives me the creeps...
Many great pianists curl the fifth finger when it's not playing. Horowitz does it all the time.


Don’t You need to look at the entire hand before you decide whether the pinkie position is a habit or tension? The OP is extremely tense


Joined: May 2001
Posts: 36,803
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
Online Content
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 36,803
Originally Posted by dogperson
Originally Posted by pianoloverus
Originally Posted by brennbaer
Originally Posted by BruceD
There is so much tension that is visible in your hands, that I found I could not watch the videos.,
watching the little finger/pinkie in the right hand literally gives me the creeps...
Many great pianists curl the fifth finger when it's not playing. Horowitz does it all the time.


Don’t You need to look at the entire hand before you decide whether the pinkie position is a habit or tension? The OP is extremely tense

That video is extremely interesting and I tend to agree with him that the curled 5th finger introduces unnecessary awkwardness or tension. At least it does when I put my finger in that position. OTOH if one watches the close up videos so easily available on YT, a surprisingly high percentage of the great pianists curl the 5th finger so I don't know if it can really be considered a technical error. Of course, one could argue that the great pianists had great technique despite having this "flaw".

Mortensen also theorizes that the 5th finger curl is caused by moving the third finger not straight down when playing a note but also towards the player while moving it down. He says this approach is wrong but I have heard very good teachers discuss this possibility with students and read about it in the advanced book simply called "Pianism". Whether this alternative approach to pressing the key straight down is good, I don't know.

frighg #3158371 09/21/21 12:45 PM
Joined: Aug 2020
Posts: 93
J
Full Member
Offline
Full Member
J
Joined: Aug 2020
Posts: 93
Must....not....stare.....at...it.
I've never seen a RH 5th finger in that curled up position.
Grab my strong hand?

It does look creepy, and there is obviously something wrong there.
OP I presume you're aware?
From your playing I'm going to take a wild guess that you're one of those who pick pieces to learn, as opposed to following a book / course / lessons...
That's not how you learn to play piano, and that's probably your enemy right there.
Stop trying to learn fancy pieces and start at the beginning.
But you know better right?

Page 1 of 2 1 2

Moderated by  Bart K, platuser 

Link Copied to Clipboard
What's Hot!!
Piano World Has Been Sold!
--------------------
Forums RULES, Terms of Service & HELP
(updated 06/06/2022)
---------------------
Posting Pictures on the Forums
(ad)
(ad)
New Topics - Multiple Forums
Estonia 1990
by Iberia - 04/16/24 11:01 AM
Very Cheap Piano?
by Tweedpipe - 04/16/24 10:13 AM
Practical Meaning of SMP
by rneedle - 04/16/24 09:57 AM
Country style lessons
by Stephen_James - 04/16/24 06:04 AM
How Much to Sell For?
by TexasMom1 - 04/15/24 10:23 PM
Forum Statistics
Forums43
Topics223,390
Posts3,349,248
Members111,632
Most Online15,252
Mar 21st, 2010

Our Piano Related Classified Ads
| Dealers | Tuners | Lessons | Movers | Restorations |

Advertise on Piano World
| Piano World | PianoSupplies.com | Advertise on Piano World |
| |Contact | Privacy | Legal | About Us | Site Map


Copyright © VerticalScope Inc. All Rights Reserved.
No part of this site may be reproduced without prior written permission
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.5
When you purchase through links on our site, we may earn an affiliate commission, which supports our community.