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Hello everybody. I'm a piano student and I'm looking for a decent digital piano to be able to practice in my "student home". The thing is that I can't spend so much money, so I'm looking for a second hand digital piano. I've been offered a Yamaha CLP 575 and a Kawai Ca48 for around 1000€ both of them. By the way, I guess I won't be able to get something better than those ones in new condition, but maybe you can suggest something new. As I was saying, I don't know which of these pianos offer best value for money. I guess yo will tell me that, first of all, I should try them. Well, I actually managed to try a Kawai Ca59 (same keyboard as Ca48) and Yamaha CLP645 (same keyboard as CLP575). I was long time ago, but I remember I enjoyed more the keyboard on the Yamaha, maybe because I tend to like heavy keyboards. About the sound, with no headphones, I also liked better the Yamaha, but there was only a tiny difference for me between them. Anyway, my main doubt is that I've seen that binaural samplings are introduced in CLP 6xx, so they are not in CLP575, and I think I'll have to play most of the time with headphones, so maybe Kawai's piano would sound better with headphones, I don't know. Also, athough I think I like better the NWX than the grand feel compact, I'm concerned about which one is, objectively, more similar to an acoustic piano action. And we'll, I don't mind very much about the sound with their speakers, but I want It to be good enough to be able to play without headphones with no limitation.

I think that's all. I will be very glad if you can give me any piece of advice. Thanks.

By the way, I've also been offered a Roland lx 706 with bench and headphones for around 2000€. This one's, as the seller says, hasn't even been taken out of the box, so it's semi new. Would you recommend making and effort to buy that one or I will have enough with one of the other 2?

Last edited by Amadeus M.; 09/21/21 08:24 AM.
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I would go with the Roland if you could. I believe it has the better action out of the three. And that price is half of what it cost here where I live. I think it has modelled sound so, that's something to be aware of.

Regardless, I think you'll be happy with any of the choices. I have the ca48 and love the feeling of the keys. I don't know much about the sound though. I have it connected to a computer and use everyone's favorite software, Pianoteq.

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Originally Posted by MattLee
....
I have it connected to a computer and use everyone's favorite software, Pianoteq.

Hear @MacMacMac eek


Yamaha U3H
Kawai VPC1
...plus some other DPs, synths, controllers and VSTs

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As you well know, my name is not **everyone**. I am MacMacMac, Shunner of Pianoteq, and Imperial Master of the Infinite Universe. smile
Originally Posted by EB5AGV
Originally Posted by MattLee
.... I have it connected to a computer and use everyone's favorite software, Pianoteq.
Hear @MacMacMac eek

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Thanks for your opinion. I would like to go for the Roland too, but, in the end, I can't afford it, so I'm going try to buy the Yamaha. The only thing I'm concerned about is that CLP 575 does not have binaural sampling, so I would like to hear the opinions of Yamaha's CLP 6xx and 7xx, which do have binaural sampling, about if there is actually a big change or it's just a bit better than regular headphone enhancement that usually DPs have. I will play with headphones most of the time and I want it to be quite good at that point.

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The binaural sampling on the Avant Grand pianos is splendid. I can't say whether such is also true of the CLP 600 and 700 pianos. I've never tried those.

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Originally Posted by Amadeus M.
The only thing I'm concerned about is that CLP 575 does not have binaural sampling...

I've owned the CLP 575 five years. Since December last year I have the CLP 785.

The CLP 575 has binaural sampling of the CFX voice but not of the Boesendoerfer. I've played 95% with headphones and the CFX binaural sound was one of the strong points of the 575. The speakers and the action are the weak points.

Very difficult to comment how much better the binaural sound of the 785 is as I was never able to compare it side by side.

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I checked the Yamaha site, brochures and manuals, but the CLP-575 doesn't look to have binaural samples... It has a "Stereophonic Optimizer", but that's a different thing... It's more like the SHS Surround effect of Kawai DPs.

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I've checked the manual and you are right it's indeed called "Stereophonic Optimizer". I don't know what's technically behind it but I can tell that the effect is very similar.

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I see. So I guess it sounds really good with headphones on. I just mind that, and not the binaural. Just wanted to enjoy the sound with headphones. And would you really say action is one of the weaker points of it? I mean, I guess is not at the level of Grand Feel III, but for people who like heavy actions, do you think there are much better actions? I don't know if NWX has long keys or they are short, and I thinks that's what matters apart from the weighting. Anyway, I'm not very concerned about action. If it is fairly similar to an upright or grand, althoug not the best, I don't mind.

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Well I am biased as I have the CLP 785 now ;-) I don't mind playing heavier actions either. It's less forgiving, forcing one to learn the right technique.
The 575 action is heavier, less balanced and kind of less precise but ofcourse it's not a bad action at all. I judge digital actions based on how they allow me to switch effortless to an upright or grand. From time to time I have access to an old Seiler upright which has a fantastic sound but a very demanding action. Very difficult to play p and pp. Since I have the 785 it's much easier for me to play on that Seiler piano.

The best thing would be if you could play the 575 yourself before you buy it to see if you are happy with the sound and the action. Relying on the opinion of others can be very wrong. There are endless threads on this forum which action is better ...

My clear favorite is the NV10 action but wait until the N1X owners jump on this topic ;-)

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Of course I will try it before buying it. It's second hand, it would be crazy to buy a second hand DP without trying it. If I don't like it, I won't buy it. But I'm afraid I won't like it because I come from an acoustic upright that is quite good.

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I think your quite-good acoustic will outperform just about any digital piano. So don't set too high a bar for the CLP575 or CA48.
Originally Posted by Amadeus M.
Of course I will try it before buying it. It's second hand, it would be crazy to buy a second hand DP without trying it. If I don't like it, I won't buy it. But I'm afraid I won't like it because I come from an acoustic upright that is quite good.
There are plenty of reasons for owning a digital piano. Matching the performance of an acoustic piano is not one of them.

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I know and I'm not looking for a digital piano that performs as my acoustic. I want to have a decent one to play when I cannot play my acoustic and so that it is not to difficult to change between their actions. I think my acoustic has a haven't keyboard and that's why I think I will like CLP 575.

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By the way, I would like to know if you think that in NWX keyboard it is more difficult to play on the black keys than on the white keys. I guess it isn't, but I've got an old keyboard which is like that and I hate it, and I think that's because black and white keys have the same and near the fallboard pivot point. Also, would you say NWX action is a tiring action? I mean, does it get tiring for your finger to play after some time (maybe 15-20 minutes)? I don't know if I expressed myself right, but I guess you know what I'm talking about.

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I would go CA48 over CLP575 (NWX is not great), CLP775 over CA99, but LX706 over all of the previously mentioned (Roland actions are lighter and easier to play, I don't really need a heavy practice-oriented keyboard). The CA48 is pretty good considering the price is very close to the high end stage pianos.

Last edited by trigalg693; 09/26/21 08:07 PM.
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Of course I will try it before buying it. It's second hand, it would be crazy to buy a second hand DP without trying it. If I don't like it, I won't bpm counter buy it. But I'm afraid I won't like it because I come from an acoustic upright that is quite good.

Last edited by Ariatremblay; 09/27/21 12:50 AM.
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SPAM reported, I recommend users do NOT click on the link and especially, do not run whatever the application in the link.

Originally Posted by Ariatremblay
Of course I will try it before buying it. It's second hand, it would be crazy to buy a second hand DP without trying it. If I don't like it, I won't freaking suspect link suppressed buy it. But I'm afraid I won't like it because I come from an acoustic upright that is quite good.


Kawai ES8, Roland RD2000, Yamaha AG06 mixer, Presonus Eris E5 monitors, Sennheiser HD598SR phones.
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In the end, Yamaha's CLP 575 owner sold it to someone else (shame on him) so I'll try to go for the Roland. I could get it at 1800€ right now, but I offered 1600€ and I think I might get it at 1700€ . Tell me what you think about the price taking into account that it is almost new.


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