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Estonia Pianos
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They are time stamped. If you find it helpful I kindly ask to my kid's band channel laugh.

Now Which one is your favourite?

My original review of the pianos:

http://forum.pianoworld.com/ubbthre...ng-higher-quality-grand.html#Post3228391

C.Bechstein L167 0:00
C.Bechstein A175 2:05
Estonia L168 4:14
Shigeru Kawai SK2 7:00
C.Bechstein A190 8:29
C.Bechstein A192 14:39
C.Bechstein B212 18:10
Schimmel K195 20:52
Schimmek K219 (chat in background) 24:11
W.Schimmel W180 27:53
Steinway Model A 30:30
Steinway Model B 33:14
Steinway Model D 36:09

Last edited by Steven Y. A.; 06/28/22 09:09 PM.

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Geez OE1FEU, there's no reason to be so nasty! If you don't have anything nice to say, you don't have to say anything.

I don't have time to listen, but Steven, you clearly put a lot of work into making this video. Hopefully others find it helpful!


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Wow, the attacks we see here sometimes.


Soli Chopin gloria
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OE1FEU, some of us asked OP for these recordings in his other thread after he let on that he had them, so he merely gave us what we asked for.

Tough to choose for me. I'm going to loop this while I work tomorrow, then decide. Obviously, the acoustics/dynamics of the recordings vary with the pianos' locations, but I'll do my best to mentally allow for that. It will be fun to try.

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I realize that this is a collection of "audio samples" and not a selection of "comparisons," because comparisons would more than likely be based on comparable sizes of different brands. However this collection goes from a 167 cm. piano to a 274 cm. piano. Most would favour, since we asked which was our favourite, the tone of the larger pianos rather than the smaller ones.

That doesn't discount the fact that some of the smaller pianos sound quite good, but I wouldn't want to base my choice on these recordings. Listening on my laptop speakers, many of the pianos sounded quite similar. I suppose a fairer judgment might be obtained by listening through more high-end equipment if the recordings were up to that challenge.

That said, this does represent quite a cross-section of piano brands and sizes and, according to the information on Youtube, all were found at only two different dealers, is that right?

Thanks for sharing.

Regards,


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I could never tell anything about any piano on the basis of a recording, for some reason my ears are just not attuned to it. But these were fun to listen to, you guys really went out of your way to try a lot of different models. Bravo.

OE1FEU, criticisms of the prep and the recording are fair (if unnecessarily harsh) but your comment about the playing itself is just plain cruel. Why go out of your way to make a fellow human feel bad? And in a forum where we all share the love of piano as well...


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When comparing pianos one should always play the same piece. Playing different pieces makes a comparison close to impossible.

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True, pianoloverus
Steven, it might be a good idea to add timestamps to specific pieces. For example:

Piece 1:
0:11
2:11

Piece 2:
0:26
5:40

And so on. I'm too lazy to do the rest, but maybe somebody else could.
When comparing sound samples, I like to switch back and forth between pianos, but with the SAME piece. The very first seconds when switching back and forth are the most useful IMO.


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So difficult to draw conclusions from this kind of audio. I played some of the audio file through on my laptop and as usual found that everything sounds pretty similar on You Tube. I suspect YT processes audio at quite low quality, and is then made worse by my laptop miniscule speakers!

Nice idea though. What did you use to do the recordings?

I tend to agree that a meaningful comparison does require at least a short section of the same piece - but also accept that it becomes tiresome as a listening experience and for the player.

I've tried recording my own piano at home many times, using all sorts of different set ups, from iPhone, through twin mic Zoom and pro mics plugged into a Revox and Nagra. Once processed to play on the computer or sound system, it always sounds a lot different to me compared with listening to the actual live piano. For that reason I couldn't choose a piano based on recordings.


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I enjoyed this. Having touched a lot of pianos the last 2 years, I recognized many of the makes in you video.

Its enough to give someone an idea of the tone of the piano and go out an try one.

it is such a personal choice.

I was surprised by the Schimmel. Never having tried one. Hopefully I will see one someday so I can compare.

I do not think you can ever really hear the sound from a recording. In the end you have to play one for real to see what it sounds like from the bench.

Even then, you are not sure until you get it home.

Thanks for the time and effort.

Ron


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Originally Posted by ronlefebvre
I was surprised by the Schimmel. Never having tried one.

Thanks for the time and effort.
Same.

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Thanks for the comments. I should be more clear: its just shopping experience that we played whatever we felt like on each individual piano, on a tascam recorder. It was never intended for a series audio comparison. It's very different from what we heard in the showroom, but still similar enough to get sound signature out of each piano. A few people requested for this so I edited the long session and reduced to 40min.
don't put up too much expectation on this laugh


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Originally Posted by AJB
So difficult to draw conclusions from this kind of audio. I played some of the audio file through on my laptop and as usual found that everything sounds pretty similar on You Tube. I suspect YT processes audio at quite low quality, and is then made worse by my laptop miniscule speakers!

Nice idea though. What did you use to do the recordings?

I tend to agree that a meaningful comparison does require at least a short section of the same piece - but also accept that it becomes tiresome as a listening experience and for the player.

I've tried recording my own piano at home many times, using all sorts of different set ups, from iPhone, through twin mic Zoom and pro mics plugged into a Revox and Nagra. Once processed to play on the computer or sound system, it always sounds a lot different to me compared with listening to the actual live piano. For that reason I couldn't choose a piano based on recordings.
]
the recording setup is less than ideal. I used a Tascam DR-05 placed on right corner of each piano facing towards bass string. Hence they all treble heavy, and the distance is very short. My favorite setup for piano is blumlein, around 2.5ft away from the soundboard.


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Thanks for all the efforts you put in this. The S&S D sounds really great. I'm pleasantly surprised by the W180, I could easily live with that instrument, sounds very balanced. The L167 and A175 sound rather uninteresting, but might be due to tuning.


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Thanks for sharing. From the recordings (I maybe listened to 20-30 seconds of each), I enjoyed the basic tone of:

Estonia L168
Shigeru Kawai SK2
C.Bechstein A190
Schimmel K195
Steinway Model D

Not all of these pianos were "ready to show" in terms of tuning/prep, based on what I was hearing. When you have whittled your finalist list down to a few serious contenders, consider calling in advance to have these pianos properly ready for your evaluation. When I did this, a week in advance of visiting a dealer, the vast majority of the time things were in good order when I got there.

Sorry for the mean-spirited comment, out of left field-- it was really uncalled for.
(I believe that user has been banned from the forum, if you click on their profile.)


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I also want to thank you for taking the time and making it ready for us to hear. I mean, you didn't need to do it for yourself, it was a service for us, so it's more than annoying when you get mean-spirited comments for it.

From what I could hear, I liked the Schimmel K195 and the Estonia L168. For different reasons, I suppose. However, I'm nowhere near as savvy as other commenters here. Just personal taste. But you also know that in the end, it doesn't matter what others say. It must please you (and probably even more so) your daughter. I just always really like the earthy/darker tone of the Estonias. How it behaves when listening "real" directly on the instrument is another question. Never had the chance to play a Grand from Estonia. The Schimmel sounded clear and sophisticated.

Definitely great how much time and love you invest in the project. Anticipation (also or especially for others) is definitely also a great joy smile

Last edited by zeitlos; 06/29/22 02:18 PM.
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Originally Posted by Rubens
True, pianoloverus
Steven, it might be a good idea to add timestamps to specific pieces. For example:

Piece 1:
0:11
2:11

Piece 2:
0:26
5:40

And so on. I'm too lazy to do the rest, but maybe somebody else could.
When comparing sound samples, I like to switch back and forth between pianos, but with the SAME piece. The very first seconds when switching back and forth are the most useful IMO.

If you listen to the video on Youtube, there are time listings for each piano beneath the video. If you listen to the video here, there are breaks in the time bar and each piano is identified when the mouse is held over each segment of that time bar. Both, actually, were very useful in listening to the videos, and comparison was facilitated by that.

The only further help would have been playing the same piece on all pianos. Still, a lot of work went into this to give us some interesting insights.

Regards,


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Unfortunately to share the audio samples is an afterthought..
It was intended as a day for three old friends shopping and trying out nice pianos. We pretty much played whatever we felt like. Maybe next time before the purchase ill do a more serious video and setup.

Steven


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Originally Posted by BruceD
If you listen to the video on Youtube, there are time listings for each piano beneath the video. If you listen to the video here, there are breaks in the time bar and each piano is identified when the mouse is held over each segment of that time bar. Both, actually, were very useful in listening to the videos, and comparison was facilitated by that.

I know that. I was talking about timestamps to the beginning of each piece, which is something entirely different.
I might add those links myself later today if I have the time to do it.


Soli Chopin gloria
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