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Every liberal needs to read what Larry just wrote, it might be long, but wow does it expose the faulty liberal logic in this thread.

I get soo frustrated trying to have an intellectual conversation, and all the liberals do is throw cheap shots and opinions, while ignoring facts.

Thank you very much Larry for that post, you articulated a summary of this thread much better than I could have. smile smile


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Thanks for the play-by-play larry! Well maybe this will make ya happier..Maybe not...

"This suggests that while MEMRI's translation may be accurate, the focus of both MEMRI and the NY Post on the current presidential election may be misplaced. Bin Laden may not be offering protection to a state that votes against Bush. He may not be talking about the election at all"
Read the Rest Here

and

""Was bin Laden attempting state-by-state blackmail? Safire misses the key aspect of bin Laden's proposed "truce," if the astonishing translation of OBL's video by the right-wing Middle East Media Research Institute (MEMRI) is to be believed. MEMRI claims bin Laden said:"any U.S. state that does not toy with our security automatically guarantees its own security." [Emphasis added]

In MEMRI's interpetation , bin Laden isn't extorting the U.S. as a nation--he's extorting every one of the 50 states. He's been reading up on the Electoral College and he's trying to neutralize potential swing states the way he neutralized Spain. He's talkin' to you, Wisconsin! It will be interesting to see if MEMRI's stunning translation holds up. ... "
Read the Rest Here
(emphasis mine).

Your friend, Nuttie. laugh


"To announce that there must be no criticism of the president, or that
we are to stand by the president right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public."-- Theodore Roosevelt
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Quote
Originally posted by The 89th Key:
Every liberal needs to read what Larry just wrote, it might be long, but wow does it expose the faulty liberal logic in this thread.

I get soo frustrated trying to have an intellectual conversation, and all the liberals do is throw cheap shots and opinions, while ignoring facts.

Thank you very much Larry for that post, you articulated a summary of this thread much better than I could have. smile smile
Except you are still guilty of a double standard - demanding facts from everyone else, when you post none.

btw, I responded to your post in the other thread.

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Larry I am sorry but your wrong. My beef with 89 is that he claims that Osama has come out and literally stated who he is voting for. He claims that he has factual evidence to support his claim. He does not. The New York times would not call that article a fact. No credited politician or organization would call that a fact. What it is, is a group of people who got together and went through Bin Ladins video with a fine tooth comb. They found a statement he made and tried their best to read in to what he was saying. This is what he said

Quote
Your security is up to you, and any state that does not toy with our security automatically guarantees its own security
and it could very easily be interpreted as a threat against voting Bush. But you can never really know what he was trying to say...and because it is speculation it can not be classified as fact. If Bin Ladin said. "A state who votes for Kerry will be spared an attack" then it would be a Fact that Bin Ladin feels that way...but as of right now this article and this idea that Osama wants Kerry is merely speculation and interpretation and nothing more.

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right-wing Middle East Media Research Institute

Just because some fanatic working for a leftwing rag calles them this does not make them a "right wing" organization, nuttie. All it means is that you soak your brain in liberal mush.

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Larry I am sorry but your wrong. My beef with 89 is that he claims that Osama has come out and literally stated who he is voting for.

Show me where he said that. Don't show me where he said the facts supported the idea, show me where he actually stated what you claim.

He claims that he has factual evidence to support his claim. But he does not. The New York times would not call that article a fact. No credit politician or organization would call that a fact. What it is, is a group of people who got together and went through Bin Ladins video with a fine tooth comb. They found a statement he made and tried their best to read in to what he was saying.

Well, yes he does have factual evidence, and no, it is *not* just a group of people who got together and tried their best to read into it what they wanted. They translated it into English, then explained it.

Here - read the entire thing in context instead of just pulling out one little statement.

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Quote
Originally posted by Larry:
All it means is that you soak your brain in liberal mush.
Don't worry, Madge, it's Palmolive.

laugh


"To announce that there must be no criticism of the president, or that
we are to stand by the president right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public."-- Theodore Roosevelt
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Except you are still guilty of a double standard - demanding facts from everyone else, when you post none.

Yes, he *did* post facts. You simply refused to accept them as such.

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Quote
Originally posted by Larry:
. All it means is that you soak your brain in liberal mush.
if you soak your brain in liberal mush
Your bleeding heart syndrome might abate
and you can ponder your socialist fate
while your liberal thoughts coagulate
so you can liberally and loudly gush
how conservative thought you've come to hate.

:p


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Quote
Originally posted by apple*:
Quote
Originally posted by Larry:
[b] . All it means is that you soak your brain in liberal mush.
if you soak your brain in liberal mush
Your bleeding heart syndrome might abate
and you can ponder your socialist fate
while your liberal thoughts coagulate
so you can liberally and loudly gush
how conservative thought you've come to hate.

:p [/b]
3hearts

Thanks for the poem, Apple. It's another print and keep.


"To announce that there must be no criticism of the president, or that
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Quote
Originally posted by Larry:


Larry I am sorry but your wrong. My beef with 89 is that he claims that Osama has come out and literally stated who he is voting for.

Show me where he said that. Don't show me where he said the facts supported the idea, show me where he actually stated what you claim .
Quote
Terrorists are for Kerry....are you?
there

Quote
Osama said that he wants Bush to lose
and there

Quote

Well, yes he does have factual evidence, and no, it is *not* just a group of people who got together and tried their best to read into it what they wanted. They translated it into English, then explained it.

Larry I am not disputing the translation it's self. I understand that highly intelligent linguists got together and translated Arabic into english. The quote I posted before is fact...Bin Ladin said that. What is NOT fact is the New York Times article which interprets the translation. There could be many interpretations of the english translation and this is only one of them. Because the article that 89th bases his claim on is made up of speculation and interpretation his source is NOT factual. There for his claim that "terrorists support Kerry" and "Osama said he wants Bush to lose" is not fact.

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In all this ideological bluster and invective, something is being lost. Bin Laden cares only about his own agenda. His flowery verse accomplished exactly what he intended. Keep everyone divided and the fear level on simmer through the final days of the election. Don't think for a moment that his choice of words were not meant to be controversial and open to interpretation.

OBL is a very jealous demagogue- he has no intention to share the spotlight with the likes of GBW or Kerry. He scored 10 out of 10 in this round of the PsyOps game.


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Quote
Originally posted by Renauda:
In all this ideological bluster and invective, something is being lost. Bin Laden cares only about his own agenda. His flowery verse accomplished exactly what he intended. Keep everyone divided and the fear level on simmer through the final days of the election. Don't think for a moment that his choice of words were not meant to be controversial and open to interpretation.

OBL is a very jealous demagogue- he has no intention to share the spotlight with the likes of GBW or Kerry. He scored 10 out of 10 in this round of the PsyOps game.
As usual Renauda -- you nailed it ... & in less than 100 words! smile

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Quote
Originally posted by Renauda:
In all this ideological bluster and invective, something is being lost. Bin Laden cares only about his own agenda. His flowery verse accomplished exactly what he intended. Keep everyone divided and the fear level on simmer through the final days of the election. Don't think for a moment that his choice of words were not meant to be controversial and open to interpretation.

OBL is a very jealous demagogue- he has no intention to share the spotlight with the likes of GBW or Kerry. He scored 10 out of 10 in this round of the PsyOps game.
Now that I agree with.

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Instead of endlessly accusing each other of not posting facts, just read the al-Jazeera translation of bin Laden's remarks yourself, and make up your own mind what it means.

I don't think it's possible to argue, after reading bin Laden's remarks, that he is anything other than implacably hostile toward Bush.

Personally, I don't think he was saying that if you vote for Kerry, you're safe. (His reference to state, I believe, was meant to mean a nation-state.) I think he was saying that if you drop your state-sanctioned support for Israel, we would not have the same incentive to attack you. I don't think that either Bush or Kerry would waver in support of Israel. Hence, I don't think bin Laden's remarks suggest that al-Qaeda will drop its targeting of the U.S. if Kerry is elected.

But that's just my interpretation. Other interpretations are equally plausible. I do agree that bin Laden seems deliberately to create ambiguity in order to foster controversy, and I also think that, regardless of what he says, there's no reason to believe he's telling the truth.

In short, I put very little weight on what bin Laden says, no matter what it might mean. There are far more interesting things to talk about.

For example, in Hart's-whatever in New Hampshire, they vote at midnight. The vote was announced at Bush 15, Kerry 15, and Nader 1.

A few hours later, the count was amended to Bush 16, Kerry 14, Nader 1.

??????????

How can we expect an accurate count in Florida or Ohio if one of the most highly-watched precincts in America can't even count 31 votes correctly?


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Originally posted by snap_apple:
Larry I am sorry but your wrong. My beef with 89 is that he claims that Osama has come out and literally stated who he is voting for.
Wrong. I never said that.

when OBL says that if you vote for Kerry, you wont be attacked...

hmmmmmm...take off your liberal blindfolds and read that.

read it again.

thank you.


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Quote
Originally posted by The 89th Key:

if you vote for Kerry, you wont be attacked...

that's what the liberals say in the coffee room laugh .


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laugh


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"when OBL says that if you vote for Kerry, you wont be attacked"

He didn't say that.

Read the transcript. I posted the link to the full transcript. Read the transcript.

If you think he said it, please quote, precisely, the portion where you THINK he said it. Because he didn't.


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Obviously he didn't say that directly, but we have thrown around his famous quote a million times now (no, quirt, not TECHNICALLY a million times)...

it is common sense that Osama says if you your state goes against Bush, then you will have security/safety/etc...

Now if he is trying to trick us or not is up to opinion...his statement about states for Kerry is not.

Anyway, I have to run now...time to watch the election all night!

Have a good nite everyone:)


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