I’m an advanced beginner with fairly solid jazz-chord theory (but lousy technique) I’ve been searching for the most efficient way to raise my playing level. Playing along with various Youtube music videos has been helpful, as well as the various free video tutorials. But I would like to ask for advice for a more structured way forward. I’m familiar with courses such as Piano with Jonny May, Piano Groove and Berklee Online. I would appreciate any opinions.
I've been online since 2007 with thousands of satisfied students from all over the world.
I've got four free courses:
Five Essential Seventh Chords Easy and efficient method for learning seventh chords https://bit.ly/2OnP68H
Five Essential Seventh Chords - Tunes This is a new FREE series showing you how to play seventh chords over standard tunes- new lessons added regularly https://bit.ly/2Nj9W4m
Improv- The Concept Goal note method for learning how to improvise a melody line https://bit.ly/2IymeFh
Major ii-V-I Progression Everything you need to know about jazz's most important progression https://bit.ly/2NjPqRj
I will for sure take a good look at it. I just watched the Five Essential Seventh Chord example. The information is the "real deal" and taught by a great jazz teacher.
Man, Dave Frank is a MONSTER!! Thanks for turning me on to him. I spent much of the morning checking him out! What an interesting man! His Master Class #46 Call me Lennie is amazing!
I’m an advanced beginner with ******* (but lousy technique) .
Different types of jazz videos do not really help.
Yes, that's really the "all important question" isn't it. You're asking me, "what is my goal"? Well, I'm a retired guy who played trumpet and bass professionally for quite a few years but now want to play the type of piano that would be suitable ..... let's say, in a fine dining room. That type of piano. (a lot of lush ballads) I was trying to convey the point that I'm not a beginner when it comes to understanding jazz chords and theory...... that's all. I understand and play tri-tone subs and rootless voicings eg. #9 chords and poly-chords. But, I'm not in any way able to play a gig. What Ive learned, I've picked up here and there. Maybe I'm looking for a course to fill in the holes. So, I wondered what would be the most efficient way to build my chops? Maybe something structured. Because, right now...... I feel I'm just "horsing around." I hope that is more clear.
I’m an advanced beginner with ******* (but lousy technique) .
Different types of jazz videos do not really help.
Doesn’t the answer depend on what is really meant by ‘lousy technique’?
Good question. I'm sure my definition of "my lousy technique" is, to a large extent, a result of just not "wood-shedding" enough. I know it takes a lot of time. But, I'm pretty much a "self-taught" player and I've read testimonials of people who said, "taking so and so's course" boosted their level more in one year than several years of playing. So, I decided to throw out the question of jazz courses. Just interested in what players have to say about it. There will be many opinions.
I’m an advanced beginner with ******* (but lousy technique) .
Different types of jazz videos do not really help.
Doesn’t the answer depend on what is really meant by ‘lousy technique’?
Good question. I'm sure my definition of "my lousy technique" is, to a large extent, a result of just not "wood-shedding" enough. I know it takes a lot of time. But, I'm pretty much a "self-taught" player and I've read testimonials of people who said, "taking so and so's course" boosted their level more in one year than several years of playing. So, I decided to throw out the question of jazz courses. Just interested in what players have to say about it. There will be many opinions.
Well, Nahum was alluding to it.
Since you are interested in gigging, I think you need lessons from someone who has (or is doing) that.
A professional jazz player would be best.
He/She could assess your skill set and provide you with direction.
Man, Dave Frank is a MONSTER!! Thanks for turning me on to him. I spent much of the morning checking him out! What an interesting man! His Master Class #46 Call me Lennie is amazing!
Here is f.e. just one question combining jazz and piano technique: which playing movements best express the swing feel?
First of all Nahum, thank you for participating. I think my stating that I have lousy technique may have misconstrued. I wasn't talking about technique as in "hand position" and that sort of thing. (on a gig, no one cares about that) What I meant was that it's one thing to have knowledge of jazz chords..... it's another thing to have the facility to play it. I want to build the facility. But, I'm not self-directing myself very well. Because I do have a good foundation in jazz theory and can play to a certain extent....... I feel I'm ready to take it up a notch. That's what I meant. But, there are a lot of available paths.... some are "for me" and some are not. Because I wasn't sure what "paths" are available, I threw the question out there,
Here is f.e. just one question combining jazz and piano technique: which playing movements best express the swing feel?
Awesome question. As a general matter, I would say economy of movement generally wins with music playing.
IME people have a really tough time swapping among "straight" to "swing" feel. Not sure how to get that. Maybe listening to lots of Jazz and playing with a lot of Jazz types.
For example, Canadian Neal Peart was considered one of the better drummers for straight time modern music; he was fantastic. I saw him play some swing music in a live hall and whilst his chops were excellent, the swing feel was awkward.
Man, Dave Frank is a MONSTER!! Thanks for turning me on to him. I spent much of the morning checking him out! What an interesting man! His Master Class #46 Call me Lennie is amazing!
Well, since you like Dave Frank, he would be the logical choice for a teacher.
He teaches via Skype.
Might work.
A teacher sitting right next to you would be best but you could try a Skype teacher and see how it goes.
Thank you for that. No doubt, Dave Frank is fantastic and gives Skype lessons to players all over he world. It would be an honor to be a student of his, but, respectfully Don, I question whether I'm at a suitable level to take lessons from someone of his caliber. I humbly think I have a lot of fundamental work to do before I'm ready for that. (and, as you say, it would be nice to find a local jazz instructor) But, I'm beginning to think, logistically, I'm after "a top notch" well organized video course to inspire me, where I can forge ahead at my own speed.
Don, I have one slight clarification. (And, believe me, I'm easily misunderstood) My intention isn't necessarily to get a gig. I think you assumed that from when I said, "I want to play the type of piano that would be suitable ..... let's say, in a fine dining room." I simply meant that, that is the "type and level" of playing I hope to aspire to..... My goal at this time, is to play well, yes, but most likely just in my living room. ;-)
What I’ve been writing about for many years: practicing swing breathing on melodica, the hands themselves find the appropriate movements on the keyboard. If only Vadim already teaches this at Berklee ...
Thank you for that. No doubt, Dave Frank is fantastic and gives Skype lessons to players all over he world. It would be an honor to be a student of his, but, respectfully Don, I question whether I'm at a suitable level to take lessons from someone of his caliber.
Thank you for that. No doubt, Dave Frank is fantastic and gives Skype lessons to players all over he world. It would be an honor to be a student of his, but, respectfully Don, I question whether I'm at a suitable level to take lessons from someone of his caliber.
I've decided to make you my manager!! LOL........ Your suggestions are all great ones.
I just checked out George Whitty's site and really like it! At this point in time, it looks like a good solution for me in that I can target the area I want to work on! And, it's very affordable. Brilliant my friend!
I wanted to let you know that Dave Frank was kind enough to send me a PM. What a pleasant surprise that was!! He gave me a lot of encouragement and told me that he has students at all levels. I hope to set up some Skype instruction with him when I feel I'm a little more confident.
This search is really interesting. I'm seeing so many courses, I never knew existed. (which was the whole point) I may even try a few courses (some have a monthly rate) to find the one I relate to the most. I'll give you my review of the George Whitty lessons soon.
Thanks again for your generous time and suggestions.
Just to let you know Sam, I also offer long-term therapy for those needing to develop more musical confidence) I start out bombarding the patient with Art Tatum recordings, then when the discouragement is at its apex we we move onto Keith Jarrett solo concert CD's until the patient dies...
Just to let you know Sam, I also offer long-term therapy for those needing to develop more musical confidence) I start out bombarding the patient with Art Tatum recordings, then when the discouragement is at its apex we we move onto Keith Jarrett solo concert CD's until the patient dies...
Dave Frank
LOL!!!!! I'm never going to read these posts with a mouthful of oatmeal again!! I couldn't stop laughing! I look forward to my therapy sessions now more than ever! Thanks!
Just to let you know Sam, I also offer long-term therapy for those needing to develop more musical confidence) I start out bombarding the patient with Art Tatum recordings, then when the discouragement is at its apex we we move onto Keith Jarrett solo concert CD's until the patient dies...
I just checked out George Whitty's site and really like it! At this point in time, it looks like a good solution for me in that I can target the area I want to work on! And, it's very affordable. Brilliant my friend!
I wanted to let you know that Dave Frank was kind enough to send me a PM. What a pleasant surprise that was!! He gave me a lot of encouragement and told me that he has students at all levels. I hope to set up some Skype instruction with him when I feel I'm a little more confident.
This search is really interesting. I'm seeing so many courses, I never knew existed. (which was the whole point) I may even try a few courses (some have a monthly rate) to find the one I relate to the most. I'll give you my review of the George Whitty lessons soon.
Thanks again for your generous time and suggestions.
Glad to hear you are finding something to your liking.
I just checked out George Whitty's site and really like it! At this point in time, it looks like a good solution for me in that I can target the area I want to work on! And, it's very affordable. Brilliant my friend!
I wanted to let you know that Dave Frank was kind enough to send me a PM. What a pleasant surprise that was!! He gave me a lot of encouragement and told me that he has students at all levels. I hope to set up some Skype instruction with him when I feel I'm a little more confident.
This search is really interesting. I'm seeing so many courses, I never knew existed. (which was the whole point) I may even try a few courses (some have a monthly rate) to find the one I relate to the most. I'll give you my review of the George Whitty lessons soon.
Thanks again for your generous time and suggestions.
Glad to hear you are finding something to your liking.
He offers very clean, detailed analysis of jazz concepts with solid examples and beautiful style.
Many of his lessons are free for your use.
Good Luck
Thanks for the reminder.
No, I hadn't forgotten. I caught myself spending so much time looking for outside sources, I was shirking my time on my keyboard. So I got some good practice-time in yesterday.
I did dive into JazzPianoOnline's "prerequisite" this morning of playing all major scales in all 12 keys, with both hands, two octaves. (sounds like necessary tough-love) Okay, I'm up for the challenge. I'd better get busy. ;-)
You can also try https://www.openstudiojazz.com/piano They have a beginner course plus intermediate and advanced. Includes theory, techniques and focused practices.
I've been online since 2007 with thousands of satisfied students from all over the world.
I've got four free courses:
Five Essential Seventh Chords Easy and efficient method for learning seventh chords https://bit.ly/2OnP68H
I have started the Five Essential Seventh Chords Course, now practicing chords on Chapter 3 and so far so good. Coming from classical IMHO it is a good starting point. You are supposed to know the 12 major scales which does not appear to be too demanding. And it's free!
You can also try https://www.openstudiojazz.com/piano They have a beginner course plus intermediate and advanced. Includes theory, techniques and focused practices.
I am very familiar with those courses.
I have not found them granular enough to move through.
You can also try https://www.openstudiojazz.com/piano They have a beginner course plus intermediate and advanced. Includes theory, techniques and focused practices.
I am very familiar with those courses.
I have not found them granular enough to move through.
I would not recommend them.
It surprised me that your experience with Open Studio was not very positive. I checked out the "products" last night. I have to admit, I was very impressed with their website. For those who don't know, the full, jazz piano course is $360/year. It's worth noting, they also offer 12- short courses that you can check out here:
I'm doing a little trial for openstudiojazz (ie. I paid for one month) and have been impressed so far. Peter has great vibe to me. There doesn't seem to be much for feedback and 2 way interaction, but as a set of videos on jazz piano it looks comprehensive and very high quality.
Have you tried Artist works jazz? Because if you found openstudio granular I think it's 10x more so. You sign up to a jazz piano course and then you have basically a years worth of lessons on how to bebop solo with the right hand (with a couple of lessons thrown in on what the left hand does). That was years ago when it first came out so it might be a lot more fleshed out now. The teaching/exercises/production is all very high but I think calling it a 'method' is a bit of a stretch.
That one was a bit of a shock as a beginner not really versed in jazz. I didn't even know what bebop was then. I just wanted to play Misty and make it sound pretty.
It looks good. It isn't the same as Dave's one to one Skype lessons, as you exchange video segments. I.e. your playing and his review.
$105 for 3 months $179 for 6 months $279 for 12 months
George Whitty appears to be a seriously talented musician! Another one to add to my collection of sites that I may use when I retire (not that far away).
PlayitSam , You must decide what you want to study. If harmony, then find the teacher whose harmony you like best. If improvisation - similar. In addition there is a facade of execution - interpretation; choose the one whose interpretation approach you like.
PlayitSam , You must decide what you want to study. If harmony, then find the teacher whose harmony you like best. If improvisation - similar. In addition there is a facade of execution - interpretation; choose the one whose interpretation approach you like.
Good points. My reason to put the question out there is to learn what is available (as well as for others who have the same question) and hopefully, dive into a real gem. I'm not in a hurry. In a perfect world, a 7-14 day free trial would be awesome, then, you'd really know if the course suits you. I believe some may have a 30 day guarantee. Otherwise, a one month subscription would be do-able.
Since I like jazz ballads, I relate well to the teaching style of Hayden Hill at PianoGroove as seen here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vE1ZHuf73u0 He gives you the basic voicings, then the subs and alterations with proper quartal harmony. Nice.
Don, honestly, lately I've been learning a lot from Youtube tutorials..... But, as mentioned, I wanted to check out a few courses, so last night, took a short-term plunge and plunked down $60 for 3 months of "PianoWithJonny." Why that course? I was impressed with his knowledge, high-energy and style of teaching (which seems like it will be a lot of fun)
While reading about PianoWithWillie-Jazz Edge this morning, my impression was that the course material looked very similar to PianoWithJonny. Like Willie Myette, Jonny May is a player with a lot of "gigging experience." Both teach a vast number of piano styles. That being said, Jonny has a 30 day guarantee, so if I don't feel the course has enough for my area of interest, I do have the option of bailing out. But...... from the vast list of lessons, I expect to be very satisfied.
For the benefit of others on this thread, I'll drop my impressions of the course along the way.
Don, honestly, lately I've been learning a lot from Youtube tutorials..... But, as mentioned, I wanted to check out a few courses, so last night, took a short-term plunge and plunked down $60 for 3 months of "PianoWithJonny." Why that course? I was impressed with his knowledge, high-energy and style of teaching (which seems like it will be a lot of fun)
While reading about PianoWithWillie-Jazz Edge this morning, my impression was that the course material looked very similar to PianoWithJonny. Like Willie Myette, Jonny May is a player with a lot of "gigging experience." Both teach a vast number of piano styles. That being said, Jonny has a 30 day guarantee, so if I don't feel the course has enough for my area of interest, I do have the option of bailing out. But...... from the vast list of lessons, I expect to be very satisfied.
For the benefit of others on this thread, I'll drop my impressions of the course along the way.
I will be interested in your view.
I was a member but took advantage of the 30-day guarantee and dropped it.
I cannot really remember why.
He keeps sending me "tips" and his stuff is good.
I seem to remember that his material did not really get me going with real-world gigging with jazz standards.
Seemed to address bits and pieces of it but no full-arrangement of a standard.
He does avoid copyright issues by using similar types of tunes but not the actual standard.
Yes Tom, he's only about a half hour away. That is a real coincidence! You play a nice piano and it's great that you enjoy playing jazz standards. Nice! I am a hobbyist but I would love to aspire to a professional level. I have a lot of work to do. Jonny is the first of a few instructors I intend to have in the next few years. I liked his energy!
Don, honestly, lately I've been learning a lot from Youtube tutorials..... But, as mentioned, I wanted to check out a few courses, so last night, took a short-term plunge and plunked down $60 for 3 months of "PianoWithJonny." Why that course? I was impressed with his knowledge, high-energy and style of teaching (which seems like it will be a lot of fun)
While reading about PianoWithWillie-Jazz Edge this morning, my impression was that the course material looked very similar to PianoWithJonny. Like Willie Myette, Jonny May is a player with a lot of "gigging experience." Both teach a vast number of piano styles. That being said, Jonny has a 30 day guarantee, so if I don't feel the course has enough for my area of interest, I do have the option of bailing out. But...... from the vast list of lessons, I expect to be very satisfied.
For the benefit of others on this thread, I'll drop my impressions of the course along the way.
I will be interested in your view.
I was a member but took advantage of the 30-day guarantee and dropped it.
I cannot really remember why.
He keeps sending me "tips" and his stuff is good.
I seem to remember that his material did not really get me going with real-world gigging with jazz standards.
Seemed to address bits and pieces of it but no full-arrangement of a standard.
He does avoid copyright issues by using similar types of tunes but not the actual standard.
As I was watching a couple of his Youtube video tutorials, he just made a couple of comments that really hit home with me (I think about harmonization.) I thought, "yeah, he's got it." I think he's pretty heavy on the blues. (which is a minor part of what I'm interested in) but my feeling was that he will light a fire under me and teach me a lot.
I'll get into his course this afternoon for a couple of hours. Should be fun.
Sam, I'm glad to know about Piano with Jonny and I too am thinking of registering for it, but I'm a little puzzled by you saying that you "plunked down $60 for 3 months", because when I go to his website, it's $40 for one month or $300 for 1 year. Did I misunderstand you?
Sam, I'm glad to know about Piano with Jonny and I too am thinking of registering for it, but I'm a little puzzled by you saying that you "plunked down $60 for 3 months", because when I go to his website, it's $40 for one month or $300 for 1 year. Did I misunderstand you?
You might try doing a search on …..piano with jonny coupon..... and see what jumps up.
Sam, I'm glad to know about Piano with Jonny and I too am thinking of registering for it, but I'm a little puzzled by you saying that you "plunked down $60 for 3 months", because when I go to his website, it's $40 for one month or $300 for 1 year. Did I misunderstand you?
Hello April,
Glad you asked. Until I read your post, I actually didn't realize what a good deal I got! I can't even tell you how I happened onto it, but if you e-mail Jonny's support people here: contact@pianowithjonny.com Tell them that you'd like to take the 10 day, 5 lesson, blues challenge, then consider the 40% off offer. I'm sure they will be happy to help you.
After you complete the 5 lessons (or not) I believe (like me) that they will offer you 3 months for $60 ($20/mo) or a full year for $180 ($15/mo)
I don't know your piano experience, but he has lessons in the courses for beginning to advanced students.
Sam, I'm glad to know about Piano with Jonny and I too am thinking of registering for it, but I'm a little puzzled by you saying that you "plunked down $60 for 3 months", because when I go to his website, it's $40 for one month or $300 for 1 year. Did I misunderstand you?
April,
This PianoWithJonny challenge just popped up on my screen. If you go here, I believe you can give your email address and he will send you 5 free lessons. When finished, you can enroll in the discounted 3 month or yearly course.
Thanks for your response Sam, and Don. Actually the blues challenge doesn’t look all that interesting to me personally, unlike the Fly Me to the Moon preview on YouTube which seems to be just exactly what I’m looking for at this time to move forward with jazz standards. I’m really quite excited about it. His regular rate does seem very reasonable and certainly worth it for me.
Thanks again for initiating this thread, Sam, and I hope you will post about how it goes for you. Have fun with it!
April, you don't have to be interested in blues or take the blues challenge. It's just the way you can get the discount on the course. But, you can pay the regular rate too. ;-)
Thanks for your response Sam, and Don. Actually the blues challenge doesn’t look all that interesting to me personally, unlike the Fly Me to the Moon preview on YouTube which seems to be just exactly what I’m looking for at this time to move forward with jazz standards. I’m really quite excited about it. His regular rate does seem very reasonable and certainly worth it for me.
Thanks again for initiating this thread, Sam, and I hope you will post about how it goes for you. Have fun with it!
You might want to look at Piano with Willie then. He has courses as part of his main site for learning standards in steps. Also a separate course for Cocktail piano and others.
The author of that site is Willie Myette (Piano With Willie).
He is currently consolidating many of his sites into a single site and he has a ton of material to work with.
Don,
When is Willie Myette consolidating his sites into a single site? I have an interest in his main site for Jazz, cocktail and blues, but also like the content of his "Rock Piano Lessons" and "Cocktail Piano Lessons" sites. I would love for all of this to be covered by one fee.
The author of that site is Willie Myette (Piano With Willie).
He is currently consolidating many of his sites into a single site and he has a ton of material to work with.
Don,
When is Willie Myette consolidating his sites into a single site? I have an interest in his main site for Jazz, cocktail and blues, but also like the content of his "Rock Piano Lessons" and "Cocktail Piano Lessons" sites. I would love for all of this to be covered by one fee.
Thanks! --Alan
He is doing it right now.
I think it will be available December 1.
You should be able to "ask" by sending a message from his site.
I may have misread things but it looks to me like if you pay for premium membership at $30 a month or $300 a year you get access to everything. I actually paid for a couple of his udemy courses at about 10:49 each..... I figure that will give me a month at least of material anyway and I'll get to figure out how much I do a don't like it. Just got it started with 12 Bar Blues and I really like the way he explained stuff. It appears that he is not only a good teacher but exudes a lot of positive energy without seeming all fake and plastic..... it also seems that the Opie is significantly more advanced in knowledge of jazz in court Theory than I am so the question of suitability becomes a little more specific
I am another convert to Jonny May. He kept sending me emails with tips. This last one hooked me. So I joined today!
See you guys on his FB page.
I’m sure taking lessons from Jonny will be a nice experience for you. I love close harmony. One of his courses taught me some nice, altered “crunch chords.” I’ll be forever grateful for showing me his closed voicing for an A7+9 specifically. (I feel like I’m channeling Bill Evans every time I play it) I’ve learned that many jazz chord voicings are not at all intuitive; It’s great to be shown what works by a real pro. Jonny will inspire you to learn many styles. My subscription runs out in two weeks but I will subscribe again.
I’ve learned that many jazz chord voicings are not at all intuitive; It’s great to be shown what works by a real pro.
I don’t know if the term “intuitively” is suitable here. More precisely, it will be: those found by ear by trial and error, which includes borrowing from classical harmony.
I’ve learned that many jazz chord voicings are not at all intuitive; It’s great to be shown what works by a real pro.
I don’t know if the term “intuitively” is suitable here. More precisely, it will be: those found by ear by trial and error, which includes borrowing from classical harmony.
I’m not the least bit interested in your silly opinion of whether my descriptive word is suitable or not. Mainly, I was taking the time to welcome a fellow player to the course, and mention what I was getting out of it. Strange, that you think it is your place to criticize MY personal experience? You said that you, “Don’t know if my term ‘intuitive’ is suitable??” So, in your academic mind, we shouldn’t learn correct, complex voicings from a seasoned professional player?? We should all just “go it alone” (and use our ear, as you put it) without the benefit of experienced players helping us learn tried and true, World-class voicings??
After reading your comment to the end, you sound like an “academic wanna-be” (aka a snob) rather than being a “real player.” Maybe you should consider landing your ego and quit trying to sound like such a critical know-it-all.
I’ve learned that many jazz chord voicings are not at all intuitive; It’s great to be shown what works by a real pro.
I don’t know if the term “intuitively” is suitable here. More precisely, it will be: those found by ear by trial and error, which includes borrowing from classical harmony.
I’m not the least bit interested in your silly opinion of whether my descriptive word is suitable or not. Mainly, I was taking the time to welcome a fellow player to the course, and mention what I was getting out of it. Strange, that you think it is your place to criticize MY personal experience? You said that you, “Don’t know if my term ‘intuitive’ is suitable??” So, in your academic mind, we shouldn’t learn correct, complex voicings from a seasoned professional player?? We should all just “go it alone” (and use our ear, as you put it) without the benefit of experienced players helping us learn tried and true, World-class voicings??
After reading your comment to the end, you sound like an “academic wanna-be” (aka a snob) rather than being a “real player.” Maybe you should consider landing your ego and quit trying to sound like such a critical know-it-all.
Dear young "advanced beginner"! I have a feeling that you are not only a beginner improviser and a new forum member, but also a beginner in relations with other forum users. Let me teach you give you a lesson , and completely for free: before attacking someone here, it’s customary to collect preliminary information about him; for example, in the posts of this person or on his website, or in the vastness of the Internet in general, including YouTube. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-9zLmwikefw
In addition, I recommend reading literature on the history of jazz, in this case the very solid " Das Grosse Jazz Buch" by Joachim Berendt, where he considers the process of the emergence of jazz harmony - maybe this will enrich you in something.
I think sometimes Nahum says things that maybe could be worded better, as I've been drawn into arguing with him in the past. However I've contacted him via private message to ask about some music that he gave some samples of (The Kid from Red Bank - Count Basie) and found him to be very friendly and helpful.
I'm not getting into the rights and wrongs of who said what, or taking sides, but I thought you should know that he is (or was) a professional Jazz player who has played at a very high level.
I’ve learned that many jazz chord voicings are not at all intuitive; It’s great to be shown what works by a real pro.
I don’t know if the term “intuitively” is suitable here. More precisely, it will be: those found by ear by trial and error, which includes borrowing from classical harmony.
I’m not the least bit interested in your silly opinion of whether my descriptive word is suitable or not. Mainly, I was taking the time to welcome a fellow player to the course, and mention what I was getting out of it. Strange, that you think it is your place to criticize MY personal experience? You said that you, “Don’t know if my term ‘intuitive’ is suitable??” So, in your academic mind, we shouldn’t learn correct, complex voicings from a seasoned professional player?? We should all just “go it alone” (and use our ear, as you put it) without the benefit of experienced players helping us learn tried and true, World-class voicings??
After reading your comment to the end, you sound like an “academic wanna-be” (aka a snob) rather than being a “real player.” Maybe you should consider landing your ego and quit trying to sound like such a critical know-it-all.
Dear young "advanced beginner"! I have a feeling that you are not only a beginner improviser and a new forum member, but also a beginner in relations with other forum users. Let me teach you give you a lesson , and completely for free: before attacking someone here, it’s customary to collect preliminary information about him; for example, in the posts of this person or on his website, or in the vastness of the Internet in general, including YouTube. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-9zLmwikefw
In addition, I recommend reading literature on the history of jazz, in this case the very solid " Das Grosse Jazz Buch" by Joachim Berendt, where he considers the process of the emergence of jazz harmony - maybe this will enrich you in something.
Good luck in your education!
My description as “advanced beginner” was meant to be tongue in cheek. I do have a fair amount of experience; with a master’s degree in music and playing professionally for 40 years in many venues. (not piano)
I am happy to hear differing opinions to mine on this forum (that’s why I joined) but your curt and critical (and frankly wrong) response to my message came off to me as silly and snooty.
I was commenting on an instructor who taught me some great voicings (and relating that experience to Tom and others on the forum who might benefit) And all you saw fit to do was to JUMP on my post and start criticizing, “I don't know if your word is suitable! I must use my ear…… USE CLASSICAL HARMONY!” Really?? Rather than learn directly from a seasoned pro??
If you have something helpful to offer people who want to learn, I would suggest you have a dialog rather than shortly, LECTURING people from your “vast musical knowledge.” You might even learn something yourself.
And, I stand by my original opinion that playing altered jazz chord voicings are not always intuitive.
I think sometimes Nahum says things that maybe could be worded better, as I've been drawn into arguing with him in the past. However I've contacted him via private message to ask about some music that he gave some samples of (The Kid from Red Bank - Count Basie) and found him to be very friendly and helpful.
I'm not getting into the rights and wrongs of who said what, or taking sides, but I thought you should know that he is (or was) a professional Jazz player who has played at a very high level.
Cheers
That’s cool Simon,
I respect your kindness to support a fellow player and try to “smooth things over.”
It seemed so odd to me, that such a benign personal opinion that, “I find [for me] closed altered chord voicings are not always intuitive” (in their stacking) so, it’s great to be shown by a pro”……… would be a statement that anyone, let alone a professional jazz player would want to criticize. Does that make sense? His strange choice of words struck me as a comment that would come from a pseudo piano intellectual rather than a real “player.”
An oversimplified example of my point would be the way Bill Evans would play….. let’s say a G7 chord. Well, any beginner in jazz piano would immediately think, “Okay, that would be G,B,D,F. But, of course, that isn’t even close to the way Bill Evans would play G7, right? He would (could) likely voice it as F,B,E. (adding a 13) And, we’re not even talking about altered “closed chords” yet. The point is, that jazz chords are NOT intuitive in their voicing. This is the statement that Nahum decided he needed to go to battle with me over?? Why? I can only speculate.
Nahum is a very helpful member. There is an international crowd here so language and culture difference sometimes cause a bit of misinterpretation by all of us.
[ I am happy to hear differing opinions to mine on this forum (that’s why I joined) but your curt and critical (and frankly wrong) response to my message came off to me as silly and snooty.
I don’t know if the term “intuitively” is suitable here. More precisely, it will be: those found by ear by trial and error , which includes borrowing from classical harmony ?
PS What happened to you after our normal dialogue at 24/10 ??? .
[ I am happy to hear differing opinions to mine on this forum (that’s why I joined) but your curt and critical (and frankly wrong) response to my message came off to me as silly and snooty.
I don’t know if the term “intuitively” is suitable here. More precisely, it will be: those found by ear by trial and error , which includes borrowing from classical harmony ?
PS What happened to you after our normal dialogue at 24/10 ??? .
Well, again, a strange message. Don’t quite know what your motivation is?
Nahum, I want to start my day today by apologizing to you for my angry reaction to your comment to me the other day. My interpretation of your message did not warrant my angry response. I over reacted and I’m sorry. In the future, I will try to do a better job of trying to understand other’s point of view. Please know that I’m profoundly sorry and as a fellow musician, wish you well in music and life.
I can speak very highly of Jazz Piano School. Brenden Lowe has a complete jazz piano course that is applicable whether one is a beginner, intermediate, or advanced player. He just redid the whole course to make it even better! 1000's of video lessons, PDF's, and what he offers is a structured, step-by-step course that covers just about everything in a structured model, with attention paid to filling in holes in one's playing and becoming a player who, can just sit down and play just about anything well and understand all the theory behind it.
He is a passionate guy who built this wonderful course out of his frustration with the hit and miss teaching he received in music school and studying with teachers with systems that just did not work for him. In addition, as a member there is a private Facebook group where one can upload a video for feedback and Brenden and his staff are available to answer questions, periodic live Q & A sessions, tune analysis, a number of specialty courses on such topics as Bill Evans voicing system, solo piano, and accompanying singers, flashcards for drilling technique, and much more. it is almost endless. I never have to search all over for anything anymore. It is all in the course. He also puts out free weekly podcasts on youtube and apple that you can access to give you a taste of what he offers. .
I am a lifetime member, and took advantage of a Black Friday offer, but there are monthly plans, with periodic specials.
I would like to thank you guys for mentioning PianoGroove. I tried Piano with Jonny for a few weeks, but tired of it quickly. But it is a very good program with a really active FB community. I had never heard of PianoGroove. As Sam said, Hayden focuses on playing jazz standards from a lead sheet. And you jump right in. I joined last week and the attention from Hayden and the staff is outstanding. He responds to questions the next day. He is in London and I'm in California. Otherwise I think it would be the same day. I am a little overwhelmed right now. He suggest you learn three songs from a lead sheet while also working on fundamentals. So I am setting Willy's Cocktail Piano course and Artist Works aside as least for the time being until I see how well I can progress on the first three standards. 🎹🎹🎹
Yes. Lead sheets, arrangements, exercises. A very active private forum. You can sign up for a month and quit if it's not what you are looking for. He also recommends iReal app and Real books. They offer 5 free lessons also.
I have gone full circle back to PianoWithWillie. (JazzEdge). The others we have discussed are all good. But I guess I am just so familiar with Willie after five years. His new website with everything combined is an improvement as is the lower price. I paid $79 a month for a Premium membership in the past. Now for $49 you can get essentially the same access. Plus he has been doing some group training.
And let me give a shout out to Brenden Lowe at jazzpianoschool.com. Great site. He was my student. I taught him in when he was in high school. He was very sharp and a great player even then.
Another vote for Jazzpianoschool.com by Brenden Lowe. I am sure there are a lot of good courses out there, but what I like so much about this is the amazing structured approach. The whole course is laid out in small step by step classes. Absolutely no time wasted to look around for the next video or the next thing to learn. You just go on to the next step in the course. It will take you from beginner to quite advanced and there is so much material it will take you years to complete the course.
I am in no way affilliated with JPS. I am just a happy studen who has taken my playing to a new level by following his course and putting in hours and hours with practice.
I was wondering if you are stilll with pianowithjonny.com? I've been looking around at some of the sites, but haven't really seem what I'm looking for (and perhaps it's mostly an unlearnable "ear" skill) which is reharmonizing. I wouldn't say I'm particularly interested in playing a particular style of jazz, I'm more drawn to laid back, reharmonized standards more along the lines of say Fred Hersch (and I'm acutely aware that I''ll never be close to these guys!) and for my personal enjoyment. I can sight read well enough jazz transcriptions and can play from a lead sheet with practice and not planning on gigging at the Village Vanguard anytime soon!
Good to hear from you. Yes, I’m still learning from Jonny May. Wow, Fred Hersch! You have good taste! If you read transcriptions, maybe some of the other members have a good resource for you.
Ballads with “altered chords” is also my main area of interest. I don’t read well, so I like to pause Youtube videos and study voicings from a virtual keyboard. For instance, this great player, Alfonso Gugliucci has this public Youtube video (that has taught me a lot) with not only a style of playing that you may like, but a good example of the tool I’m talking about. If you slow the video speed down, it's easier to capture. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tuwByyuxWaw
Thanks for the reply! I've found some of the best transcriptions on YouTube and blogs (currently enjoying a transcription of Fred Hersch's version of the R&H "This Nearly Was Mine.") I believe you had mentioned Alfonso Gugliucci in a previous post and I enjoyed listening to him but I don't have the patience for a virtual keyboard (though I'll occasionally suffer through one if I'm particularly curious about "a" chord or "a" voicing.) I've looked through a few of the more recommended books on jazz piano and harmony but at my age (middle 60's) they're a bit much to tackle, particularly the highly recommended Mark Levine book. I did just get "The Jazz Harmony Book" by David Berkman and it's looking like I might have finally hit the jackpot with his rather unassuming subtitle of "A Course in Adding Chords to Melodies." It just arrived today, but I'm really impressed this far.
Anyway, I appreciate your reply and wish you well with Mr May! I'll see if anyone might care to comment if they've seen any online courses that address reharmonization to some extent.
I just had the pleasure of listening to Fred Hersch playing the piece you mentioned; This Nearly Was Mine. Oh, that was amazing! I know the piece, (but not from its title.) I listened to the first 80% without recognizing it, even though he drops subtle hints. Then, he reveals and rewards you with that beautiful melody at the end. You’ve turned me onto something really great! Thank you so much!
Glad you found a promising harmony book. I’m also a big believer in doing a lot of intensive listening and find that nuances and techniques automatically and unknowingly, creep into my playing.
I had the same experience the first time I heard it too and of course the first 80% is really the best part. I wish I could play more secure 10ths (Fred is 5'5"- I can't believe he can reach a 10th so easily) because rolling them even quickly really detracts, but one must row with the oars one has!
Thanks so much to each of you for taking the time to share your experiences.
If I'm reading everything right, this group includes at least a couple of old dawgs wanting to learn new tricks and looking for some informed leadership to guide the way. If this is the case, at 76, I fit right in.
The thing that really interest me is not so much "jazz" itself but studying "making music in the moment" regardless of what stylistic label is used to describe it. For me it's more about learning how music works or what's making something that sounds so good, and moves me so much that I have to take a deep breath to keep my vision clear of tears that sometimes fill my eyes.
So I appreciate all the detailed conversations & posts.
I understand basic music theory but my understanding and my ears outdistance my ability to put it all into practice, so at this stage in life I recognize that if I'm going to get to make some of these wonderful sounds for myself I better find a clear and organized approach to getting the theory into my hands and my body so I don't have to think about what I'm doing.
This thread has given me many options to investigate in my efforts to find a road map to follow and I thank y'all for your advice and inspiration.
I know just how you feel…. Wondering which road to take to improve in an efficient way. I have a computer set-up in my digital piano nook so the computer is where I find most inspiration. It works well for: 1) a very diverse paid course, 2) free tutorials, 3) and “playing-along” with bands on Youtube (which is the most fun!) My 4th source (a big source) is using the Real Book (and fake books of standards)
The paid course is where I learn the most. It is also the most difficult as it pushes me out of my comfort zone. It makes you work!
So, if you don’t use a personal instructor, maybe you can get your inspiration from one of those sources. The paid courses and free tutorials on Youtube have lessons for all levels and musical styles. (it’s a good time to be alive)
The cool thing about playing piano is that no matter what level we are at, we find joy! Let me know if I can shed any light on your search or you just want to chat.
I'm currently following up on all the suggestions made in the thread. Some I was aware of others look like new treats.
Has anyone ever checked out Steve Nixon's offerings. I'm especially interested in any intel on his Inner Circle / Private Mentoring program?
Originally Posted by PlayitSam
The cool thing about playing piano is that no matter what level we are at, we find joy!
I agree completely.
I've a small book of quotes concerning music and one that I glommed onto was one where the gist of it was "Music is the only thing in life worth doing poorly" which I take to mean forget your judgements about what you're doing and just do some music. It is worth something to you. It makes you better. It heals you. It's the cure for what's ailing you when you don't even realize you're ailing.
And no, I don't think this is cover for playing poorly, but an encouragement to keep at it regardless of the "not good enough" judgement that sometimes echos in the halls of our minds. It's an ally in fighting off the urge to compare yourself with other players and just continue on to find your way of being musical . . . as best you can.
It's kind of like my experience of surfing years ago. I was never very good but as long as I got in the water and did whatever I could do, I walked away feeling really good. Even as recently as a couple of years ago when I should have known better than to get back on a board after 40 or more years of not doing so. I almost got myself drowned - this is not hyperbole - but I felt overjoyed at just doing it.
FYI to anyone out there looking for a real jazz piano guru, Dave Frank is a killer teacher (and obviously a monster player). Not all great players are great teachers, but Dave excels at both, possibly because he himself had such amazing teachers. (I think teaching is a skill passed down, just like playing is.) Dave's teachers were arguably two of the all time greatest jazz piano teachers--Lennie Tristano and Charlie Banacos.
Dave teaches from books that he authored, and has a very systematic, week by week approach that gets results. He is the real deal, a swingin' jazz cat straight from NYC to your ears! Nice guy, too.
Thanks for reviving this thread. I’m using JazzEdge right now I really like it! there is a ton of material and seems possible to find something for just about anyone at any level and new content getting added all the time.
After perusing this list, I like the descriptions of some of what’s mentioned above, and I’m keeping this list for reference as I grow in my playing. Im a 50yo advanced beginner heading toward intermediate and loving exploring jazz and cocktail piano.
I also do have an in person teacher and he has added immensely on the intangibles that are hard to engage using an online course.
Thanks for reviving this thread. I’m using JazzEdge right now I really like it! there is a ton of material and seems possible to find something for just about anyone at any level and new content getting added all the time.
After perusing this list, I like the descriptions of some of what’s mentioned above, and I’m keeping this list for reference as I grow in my playing. Im a 50yo advanced beginner heading toward intermediate and loving exploring jazz and cocktail piano.
I also do have an in person teacher and he has added immensely on the intangibles that are hard to engage using an online course.
Love this site, thanks all!
Jazz Edge looks good as well.
The 30 day trial especially.
I plan on finishing the Udemy course and getting my 12 major keys back in shape, then I will probably do the 30 day Jazz Edge thing.
I watched the intro vids for Jazzskills.com - EXCELLENT explanations. This is next on my list once I get to a better place.
Here is a youtube video where he explains his philosophy.
He has other numerous youtube videos, also .... if you wish to investigate his style further.
This looks like some great content. I think I’ll give this a try too as it would be nice to have some variety and supplemental material. While I focus on pop/rock piano I did read that “learning jazz you will naturally improve your pop and rock studies” Would you agree with that?
Thanks for reviving this thread. I’m using JazzEdge right now I really like it! there is a ton of material and seems possible to find something for just about anyone at any level and new content getting added all the time.
After perusing this list, I like the descriptions of some of what’s mentioned above, and I’m keeping this list for reference as I grow in my playing. Im a 50yo advanced beginner heading toward intermediate and loving exploring jazz and cocktail piano.
I also do have an in person teacher and he has added immensely on the intangibles that are hard to engage using an online course.
Love this site, thanks all!
I enjoyed reading about your piano experience. It looks like Piano Edge has a ton of valuable information. You have a great situation of online sources AND a “live teacher.” The best of both worlds! With that combination, you’ll be a solid intermediate player in no time. :-)
I took a quick look at the udemy course you mention and I like how simple structured it looks like. Do you knows if they have follow up courses at udemy?
For me .... it has given me new interest and direction.
My interest has been waning these past few years because I did not see myself attaining the ability to just sit down and play standards without memorizing what I intended to play.
His stuff is aimed at learning the jazz language so you can play as easily as you can talk .... once you have learned the language.
That is appealing to me.
Once again ..... there are no shortcuts. You have to do the work.
For me .... it has given me new interest and direction.
My interest has been waning these past few years because I did not see myself attaining the ability to just sit down and play standards without memorizing what I intended to play.
His stuff is aimed at learning the jazz language so you can play as easily as you can talk .... once you have learned the language.
That is appealing to me.
Once again ..... there are no shortcuts. You have to do the work.
The site looks interesting. How does the www.jazzskills.com site compare to Willie Myette's offerings, jazzedge, learnjazzpiano.com, etc.?
How does the www.jazzskills.com site compare to Willie Myette's offerings, jazzedge, learnjazzpiano.com, etc.?
It is very difficult to explain the differences but I can say this ....
On Willie's site (Jazzedge) you will find many examples of how to play things note for note with written notation provided also.
On Shan Verma's site (Jazzskills) you will find very little of that. It consists mostly of explanations (videos) of concepts and how you can go about harmonizing a chord progression or melody within the framework of the methods he is presenting.
Shan categorizes you as at a particular level of skills and tells you how you should approach a tune within that level.
He is not a fan of just memorizing how to play things. He does encourage playing tunes but only at your skill level.
Thanks @dmd I know shortcuts don’t exist. I learned that a while back. I agree that anything that sparks interest whether for a moment or long time is a win. Thanks for sharing your thoughts on the course.
Greg Spero is a young professional jazz pianist who has been running a great YouTube channel called WeeklyPiano for about ten years. He has over 500 videos on there now. The channel is pitched at intermediate and advanced players. He has some great videos. So it's a great free resource. This is his biography: https://www.gregspero.com/bio
His video most popular video "How to Become a Well Rounded Jazz Pianist (in 42 minutes)" is a great overview of the skills needed to be a decent player.
He has been improving the channel's production values. Here's a great example of his new style. "Playing Jazz With Good Time and Feel: Swing Demystified"
I’ve been a member of Jazzskills.com for about two weeks now. I’m very impressed with Shan and his methods. I’ve actually asked some questions and he responded the same day within hours. He also does live workshops for members using zoom meeting app where he puts students from all over that have camera set ups on the screen and teaches concepts live. You can also ask questions if your just watching . Pretty cool site if you ask me. I’m in what he calls the fluency part of his curriculum right now where he teaches the basics of Jazz. I found him through this thread so I figured I would resurrect it and say thanks to dmd.
I am currently a member of pianogroove.com and own a few courses from Open Studio as well. I think I will join Open Studio eventually but feel it would be a better investment when I am playing at a higher level. Both sites have plenty of free content on youtube to check out. I tried a couple others before these but just didn't vibe with the playing styles. Plenty of great options these days though!
Even with the online courses I've decided to get some local instruction as well. It can be a bit overwhelming with so much to work on and so much content available and I am finding it very helpful to have specific goals to work towards with a teacher in person. Not to mention making sure my technique is developing correctly along the way.
I love Shan's JazzSkills approach too, Stew. He's a wonderful teacher!
I also am big fan. I watch many piano -based YT teachers but I also watch guitar, sax, bass, etc. that can add any new perspectives to thinking about jazz.
This forum/thread is great! Thanks everyone for sharing your insights, suggestions and experiences.
I have been a Piano with Jonny member for a couple of years, but am afraid I've outgrown what he offers. Any by that, I mean to say I am somewhat bored with his teaching style/methods. I assume that can happen with any online platform which is why I am somewhat reluctant to commit to a yearly membership with others when want I am looking for is a more personal mentorship - an instructor who can assess my playing and tailor classes to my level and goals and liking.
I've scoured the online platform communities and have had some level of experience with many mentioned with exception of Dave Frank whom I learned of through this forum - thanks!! I am a Rock, Blues, Jazz player and am very interested in upping my improvisation game. Dave has some great Master classes that have helped tremendously - ALL FREE. Many times, going back to basics can help to self-assess. Dave has some great ideas which have caused me to change up my playing - in a good way!
My struggle is finding the line in the sand between pursuing an in-person teacher to tailor my lessons, versus an online platform that can somewhat address my needs. It's a tough line to draw. I'm reluctant to pay a year subscription for content in which I am only interested in a sliver of.
The last thing I would add is that I practice an average of two hours daily. The question of "what" to practice and "how" to practice efficiently keep coming up and I cannot seem to find any specific answers to these questions which I know is personal and subjective. Everyone says "set a goal", then break it down to its pieces and parts. Yes, I know. I do that. BUT, there are so many goals and so many paths, that I frequently move down the wrong path and along the way, do not always know "how" to apply the new skills I learn. It's a long journey and I am happy to put in the work but personal attention from a mentor would really be helpful.
Wish I could just download Oscar Peterson's skills into my brain. That would make this a whole lot easier! Haha!
They have a number of Jazz related Piano courses that you can subscribe to, and have a lot of free on-line content in the way of podcasts, YouTube vidoes etc. Their Piano tutors include Adam Maness and Peter Martin, who regularly post on YouTube and Instagram.
I admit I haven't bought any long term subscriptions from them, though I did buy a Peter Martin 'pack' when it was reduced in price a year or so ago, which was great value. His performances of half a dozen Stevie Wonder tunes, with full transcriptions and video guidance from him for each tune.
But from what I've read their subscription services are highly rated. I believe Adam Maness runs regular on-line sessions.
Talking about this has just reminded me of something I must post. If you're not familiar with Peter Martin see the thread that I'll post following this reply. Two Peter Martin's for the price of one!
Downloading Oscar Peterson's skill set is on my wish list as well :-)
Yep, know them, LOVE them! I'm a big fan of their podcast. They too have really good content and cover a lot of ground, but even there, I can't get the personal attention I want to streamline my personal path and practice efficiently. I'm looking for structured guidance from a mentor who can provide a personalized approach. It used to be that way, but since the pandemic, seems there has been a surge in online teaching and a slump in in-person teaching.
I'll look for your post. If Peter Martin would give me personal attention, I'd be very happy!
Two sessions per week, written and performance homework, group playing, and individual feedback. I took it last year--fantastic!
Open Studio Pro (which is expensive) offers the potential for individual feedback through occasional masterclasses and guest instructors (other than Adam and Peter); I've tried Open Studio but not Open Studio Pro, so can't speak to the reality (or lack thereof) of personalized guidance. Perhaps someone else will chime in.
Wish I could just download Oscar Peterson's skills into my brain. That would make this a whole lot easier! Haha!
Oscar was an amazing player. But he did work for it. I recall an interview done many years ago where he talked about his piano teacher making him play classical works that worked on skills that carried over into the realm of jazz.
While I love some of what Oscar does, he often "runs away" with stuff to the point where it loses its appeal to me. The concepts that "faster is better" and "more notes is better" doesn't always work well for me, as a listener or as a player.
Wish I could just download Oscar Peterson's skills into my brain. That would make this a whole lot easier! Haha!
Oscar was an amazing player. But he did work for it.
While I love some of what Oscar does, he often "runs away" with stuff to the point where it loses its appeal to me. The concepts that "faster is better" and "more notes is better" doesn't always work well for me, as a listener or as a player.
I so agree with this @Bellyman - it’s a “more is more” approach which I find difficult sometimes as a listener and as a player. It’s technically impressive and there’s no questioning the virtuosity, but my ear needs a breather to digest the notes!
They have a number of Jazz related Piano courses that you can subscribe to, and have a lot of free on-line content in the way of podcasts, YouTube vidoes etc. Their Piano tutors include Adam Maness and Peter Martin, who regularly post on YouTube and Instagram.
I admit I haven't bought any long term subscriptions from them, though I did buy a Peter Martin 'pack' when it was reduced in price a year or so ago, which was great value. His performances of half a dozen Stevie Wonder tunes, with full transcriptions and video guidance from him for each tune. Cheers
I posted earlier about Jeremy Siskind's Fullerton College course which I took in spring 2022 (the intermediate level)--it was terrific and offered both personal guidance (there are ~5-8 students per section), motivation, and accountability. Since that time I've had the opportunity to try Open Studio, both the "regular" version (tutorials, resources, etc, all pre-recorded) and OS Pro (the expensive version with live courses and sessions (listening, masterclasses, ear training, etc). Regular Open Studio is excellent but diverse--different instructors, styles, approaches, etc. I didn't use it very much, and preferred as an alternative, Piano Groove, which I found very helpful in terms of fundamentals. OS Pro is outstanding for an intermediate/advanced player who knows most of the fundamentals, is comfortable reading a lead sheet, and is looking for personal advice/guidance; many of the live courses are geared around each student playing a weekly assignment and receiving individual feedback. There are a handful of semi-pros who are OS pro members and occasionally show up to masterclasses with, e.g. Geoffrey Keezer, Emmett Cohen, Helen Sung, Peter Martin.
The biggest problem with OS pro is also the biggest problem with learning jazz piano (or anything else) from the internet--the challenge is not finding content, the challenge is filtering through it to find what will be most helpful. For OS Pro there are ~20 sessions per week among 3-4 different instructors. It makes the most sense (in my opinion) to find one or two instructors whose approach/style is a good personal match and stick with them, for a total of 2-3 sessions per week. For fans of the free OS podcast, Peter and Adam have a relevant episode this week on accountability that is very relevant.
They have a number of Jazz related Piano courses that you can subscribe to, and have a lot of free on-line content in the way of podcasts, YouTube vidoes etc. Their Piano tutors include Adam Maness and Peter Martin, who regularly post on YouTube and Instagram.
I admit I haven't bought any long term subscriptions from them, though I did buy a Peter Martin 'pack' when it was reduced in price a year or so ago, which was great value. His performances of half a dozen Stevie Wonder tunes, with full transcriptions and video guidance from him for each tune. Cheers
I posted earlier about Jeremy Siskind's Fullerton College course which I took in spring 2022 (the intermediate level)--it was terrific and offered both personal guidance (there are ~5-8 students per section), motivation, and accountability. Since that time I've had the opportunity to try Open Studio, both the "regular" version (tutorials, resources, etc, all pre-recorded) and OS Pro (the expensive version with live courses and sessions (listening, masterclasses, ear training, etc). Regular Open Studio is excellent but diverse--different instructors, styles, approaches, etc. I didn't use it very much, and preferred as an alternative, Piano Groove, which I found very helpful in terms of fundamentals. OS Pro is outstanding for an intermediate/advanced player who knows most of the fundamentals, is comfortable reading a lead sheet, and is looking for personal advice/guidance; many of the live courses are geared around each student playing a weekly assignment and receiving individual feedback. There are a handful of semi-pros who are OS pro members and occasionally show up to masterclasses with, e.g. Geoffrey Keezer, Emmett Cohen, Helen Sung, Peter Martin.
The biggest problem with OS pro is also the biggest problem with learning jazz piano (or anything else) from the internet--the challenge is not finding content, the challenge is filtering through it to find what will be most helpful. For OS Pro there are ~20 sessions per week among 3-4 different instructors. It makes the most sense (in my opinion) to find one or two instructors whose approach/style is a good personal match and stick with them, for a total of 2-3 sessions per week. For fans of the free OS podcast, Peter and Adam have a relevant episode this week on accountability that is very relevant.
Hi Plinian. I was also in that course at Fullerton (Daniel). I found nothing better than that to continue, so I am just using his books. I have not tried any other online course but in my opinion I would consider only courses where you can get some feedback. I would not pay much money just for information or demonstration in videos, like in OS regular.
On the other hand, trying to make progress on my own with Jeremy´s book and videos is hard mostly because I get discouraged frequently when I realize how far I am still from not sounding like a beginner in spite of two years of very good quality teaching. Jazz piano is hard, and solo Jazz Piano (my ultimate goal) is even harder. Only the very talented people can make fast progress.
I miss the social interaction with other students like we used to have in that course. I wish there was a group study for people using his method books. OS premium sounds interesting, but too expensive for me.
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